Reds humiliated as Bulls earn home semi

[tic]

^^ I know - just illustrating the schoolboy banality of the argument that goes "we beat x and you lost to them, so we are clearly better and you are s**t". The Waratahs this year have shown that the form of one year often means little the next. Cocky people should remember that.

[JediKnight]

Who's calling who Cocky?

[tic]

Well old man, I'm not the one going around saying Sharpe left qld because Qld are obviously crap and the Force are brilliant. You do the maths. What I will say is that your comments writing off Qld Rugby are bizarre. It will, like it has before, become a dominant force - the timing is the question, and this depends on things such as injuries etc. One thing that we now know, is that the player exodus is well and truly over and the retained players, some quite green, are very talented - they simply need a coach to bring out their best. Eddie Jones? My money is on him not coaching Reds next year. Michael Foley?

[Happy]

has eddie signed for next year .. I though he did ? I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't there either!

[Burgs]

Cocky people should remember that.

Why pick on farmers

[frontrow]

Tic, get that bug( or is that a tick) out of your arse mate, do you actually realise that you are on a Force supporters site, not a QRU site...We are all used to the odd bit of sh*tstirring on here, but you really cannot seem to cope with it at all...
Of course we are gonna be more positive about our team, especially when it has performed as well as it has, and no one is taking away the fact QRU has been a much better outfit than it currently is, but at the moment they are not going along so well, so you can expect a bit of stick...God knows we stirred the crap out of the tahs all year as well, but we give as good as we get, and we move on...My suggestion to you is relax, and move on man...

[Happy]

how do you spell contradiction FR ???

[tic]

Tic, get that bug( or is that a tick) out of your arse mate, do you actually realise that you are on a Force supporters site, not a QRU site...We are all used to the odd bit of sh*tstirring on here, but you really cannot seem to cope with it at all...
Of course we are gonna be more positive about our team, especially when it has performed as well as it has, and no one is taking away the fact QRU has been a much better outfit than it currently is, but at the moment they are not going along so well, so you can expect a bit of stick...God knows we stirred the crap out of the tahs all year as well, but we give as good as we get, and we move on...My suggestion to you is relax, and move on man...

Yes but this is a Reds sub forum. If I'm not welcomed within here let me know and I will go.

Back to topic. My 2 cents is that Jones must go. People up here are filthy that after the Pretoria debacle, he went to England instead of coming straight back to face the music. I believe Jones WAS a good appointment but that he has managed the season badly.

When he was appointed, he said he would bring a Wallabies programme to the Reds. Great in theory. This worked well in the early rounds with a win over the Hurricanes and very near wins against the Crusaders and the Brumbies. But as Qld's horrendous injury toll grew, more and more rookies were blooded. This is when the coaching programme needed to change.

These young blokes are very very talented, but not experienced enough to execute Eddie's complex play book. Eddie should have been drilling them in the basics of tackling, passing, running lines, ball security etc - but no, he continued having them attempt complex and spectacular backline moves.

This was evident whilst watching Quade Cooper play the Lions (yet another near victory murdered by the Reds). Remember, Cooper was playing First XV schoolboy rugby only twelve months ago. In this match, Cooper knocked on about 6 times in the first half. He clearly was not watching the ball into his hands - instead, turning to execute one of Eddie's complex plays before he had secured the ball.

Evidently, when challenged about tactics by assistant coaching staff, Eddie gave no quarter. Herein lies the problem.

Eddie will only give the Reds one more year at most. As most current players have already been retained, I believe a new coaching structure is needed for the next three years.

These players have sweated their guts out at training all year - so player attitude is no problem. But between now and February, these talented young guys need to be drilled and drilled and drilled in the basics so that they become second nature. If so, this season won't be a total loss as the young guns got a lot of valuable game time and experience. They could hopefully then develop a more sophisticated game plan as the season unfolds - unlocking a huge amount of talent.

But the coaching structure is critical and these young blokes must be nurtured one on one. This, I believe, is where Eddie must get off the bus.

[Happy]

of course you are welcome tic !!! sometimes these one-eyed FORCEers need tidying up

[tic]

Thanks - and don't get me wrong, the turnaround in Force has been encouraging. John Mitchell is great and you are lucky to have him. Now if only Qld could secure a coach to work at developing this next generation of players (not Eddie).

[Happy]

These young blokes are very very talented, but not experienced enough to execute Eddie's complex play book.

I agree with the young players comment but my thoughts are Eddie hasn't got anything in his play book which just about every other senior Coach hasn't worked out.

his light, fast running and attacking rugby in his early Wallabies tenure was something traditionalist rugby coaches hadn't seen and he (we) got great rewards with it, but once it was understood and overcome his continuation with this same book eventually became his demise!

[AndyS]

Good post Tic. How do you see the ARC fitting in to the squad development? Assuming he stays, I would have thought a few of the players would enjoy the break from Eddie. It will also be interesting to see how Eddie interacts with the coaching teams of the two ARC teams.

[tic]

Maybe - but the point is that Eddie's early tactics of playing hard, grinding, ugly, basic rugby was working to a degree. It certainly should have been maintained when the young blokes had to step up, and had it continued, the Reds probably would have secured the lollies in a few more close games such as the Lions and the Chiefs. But alas, he seems to have got bored with that after a few rounds and inflicted a layer of complexity upon the nervous game heads of numerous young fellas.

Good post Tic. How do you see the ARC fitting in to the squad development? Assuming he stays, I would have thought a few of the players would enjoy the break from Eddie. It will also be interesting to see how Eddie interacts with the coaching teams of the two ARC teams.

Well apparently the word going around is that Eddie won't even be here for the ARC - will be in England at this time - again giving the impression that his heart isn't in it here. I can't tell you the level of anger in Qld at the moment - there is a major grassroots feeling that Jones needs to go, particularly if he won't even be around to assess the talent at ARC time. John Mitchell would never bugger off like that.

[frontrow]

Yes but this is a Reds sub forum. If I'm not welcomed within here let me know and I will go.

Back to topic. My 2 cents is that Jones must go. People up here are filthy that after the Pretoria debacle, he went to England instead of coming straight back to face the music. I believe Jones WAS a good appointment but that he has managed the season badly.

When he was appointed, he said he would bring a Wallabies programme to the Reds. Great in theory. This worked well in the early rounds with a win over the Hurricanes and very near wins against the Crusaders and the Brumbies. But as Qld's horrendous injury toll grew, more and more rookies were blooded. This is when the coaching programme needed to change.

These young blokes are very very talented, but not experienced enough to execute Eddie's complex play book. Eddie should have been drilling them in the basics of tackling, passing, running lines, ball security etc - but no, he continued having them attempt complex and spectacular backline moves.

This was evident whilst watching Quade Cooper play the Lions (yet another near victory murdered by the Reds). Remember, Cooper was playing First XV schoolboy rugby only twelve months ago. In this match, Cooper knocked on about 6 times in the first half. He clearly was not watching the ball into his hands - instead, turning to execute one of Eddie's complex plays before he had secured the ball.

Evidently, when challenged about tactics by assistant coaching staff, Eddie gave no quarter. Herein lies the problem.

Eddie will only give the Reds one more year at most. As most current players have already been retained, I believe a new coaching structure is needed for the next three years.

These players have sweated their guts out at training all year - so player attitude is no problem. But between now and February, these talented young guys need to be drilled and drilled and drilled in the basics so that they become second nature. If so, this season won't be a total loss as the young guns got a lot of valuable game time and experience. They could hopefully then develop a more sophisticated game plan as the season unfolds - unlocking a huge amount of talent.

But the coaching structure is critical and these young blokes must be nurtured one on one. This, I believe, is where Eddie must get off the bus.

What can i say, this is by far the best post you have ever done on here, well said mate...
Don't get me wrong tic, i welcome everyone on here with thier own opinions, i was only refering to the tit for tat sniping taking place more than anything...You are obviously right into your rugby, and from this post and your last one i am impressed with your knowledge of the Qld scene, and therefore your input is an excellent perspective for us...So don't take offence mate, keep the good quality classy posts coming, just lay off the tit for tat, even if you are being provoked by some of our top shelf stirrers...

Happy, condradikshon....thats it isn't it...

[AndyS]

Ah, right, apparently off to Saracens. I've got to agree, that is extremely ordinary - S14 off-season for the coach should be about the development structure, promotion of the sport etc etc. I seem to remember JM even refereed at least one of the juniors matches last year. It is maybe a bit more of a focus here where there is more need to grow the games profile, but I doubt there is anywhere that that sort of connection between the professional level and grassroots wouldn't help. It is certainly something that League and AFL are really good at.