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Thread: ARU $3.5m offer to keep Lote

  1. #31
    Veteran Contributor frontrow's Avatar
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    I have always prided myself as a prop forward or hooker, and wouldn't want it any other way, as we are the unsung heroes of every game...
    Sure, young kids will aspire to be a giteau or a Tuquiri or what not, but the reality is we are not all dealt a fair hand at birth and some of us grow tall, others are squat, others can run really fast...
    When you get to about thirteen you will begin to realise your abillities will not necessarily match your ambitions, which is when you begin to look for role models in various positions that you can aspire to...Then you make that position your own and fine tune your abilities...
    Unfortunately for us in the engine room, a lot of the work in winning good ball, and clearing out over rucks and mauls is work that doesn't involve actual ball handling as such, that is were the "glory boys" in the backline come into play...
    So, what i am trying to say is that not everyone wants to be a giteau or Gregan, but if they can be good luck to them, but for others they may aspire to be a rodzilla or cannon just as much as the giteau/gregan fan does, so i don't really totally agree with your idea nick that they are the ones who put bums on seats because ruggers is a fifteen man game played by up to 22 men of all different shapes and sizes and skills and abilities, and the people who support these players are also made up of these different attributes, so there is support for all players, and i know a lot of ex players who want to meet the guy who played in thier position for the Wallabies or Force or wherever just as much as the other players too...And you can bet they will let thier kids know who does what on a pitch so that they recognise it isn't all about the backline, it is a team game...

    So as for wether Tuquiri is worth 10x that of a prop then i guess my opinion is no, not even close...

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  2. #32
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    Burgs,
    Yeah, Hewitt was a bit of a call but at least he has a turn of speed. Wonder what he is paid comparatively.

    Nick,
    If the offer includes any external sponsor payments then it is dirt cheap. What they amount to is unknown, but who it is that the sponsors want to represent them is up to them - it shouldn't impact on who gets paid how much to play for the Wallabies. Player popularity and drawing power for supporters is a point well made though. I just hope Warnie doesn't decide to take up Rugby...what would they pay for his pulling power?

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  3. #33
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    Great post frontrow

    Back to Lote, I do remember reading in one of the articles late last night that the external "sponsor" aspect of the payments were going to be minimal as he didn't like the variability of such arrangements. What I can't recall is if that was the Union offer or the potential Souths one, but either way you would assume it to be the case for all if that is his position.

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  4. #34
    Player Nick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frontrow
    So, what i am trying to say is that not everyone wants to be a giteau or Gregan, but if they can be good luck to them, but for others they may aspire to be a rodzilla or cannon just as much as the giteau/gregan fan does, so i don't really totally agree with your idea nick that they are the ones who put bums on seats because ruggers is a fifteen man game played by up to 22 men of all different shapes and sizes and skills and abilities, and the people who support these players are also made up of these different attributes, so there is support for all players, and i know a lot of ex players who want to meet the guy who played in thier position for the Wallabies or Force or wherever just as much as the other players too...And you can bet they will let thier kids know who does what on a pitch so that they recognise it isn't all about the backline, it is a team game...

    So as for wether Tuquiri is worth 10x that of a prop then i guess my opinion is no, not even close...
    Front row, I am one of those kids that realised very early on that I was never going to be in the backline and grew up with Sean Fitzpatrick and Zinzan Brooke as the players I admired the most. I have played entirely in the forwards.

    I also love that Union as opposed to Leauge or AFL embraces all shapes and sizes (sorry to any huge fans of those codes) but I stand by my opinion that in Australia the Front Row are not valued the same way as Backs and "Glory Boys" in SA, NZ, or UK this is a different story.

    If Im that far off the mark why is it that the Backs seem to get paid so much more than Forwards in Australia?

    Im not suggesting that it's right or fair and anyone who has played rugby knows how much it really depends on everyone doing there part.

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  5. #35
    Veteran Contributor frontrow's Avatar
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    I don't necessarily disagree with you regarding the value placed on our frontrow, that is half the problem with the Wallabies at the moment...I just didn't agree with your reference that people only go to watch the likes of Giteau etc and that is why they deserve the big $$$$...As a fellow kid who grew into his position i can say my role models where all based in the forwards, although i admired a lot of the backs as well for thier finishing ability...One of the problems i guess is that remuneration for the forwards, in particular the props seems to be based on the assumption that you need to be fast and have a good photogenic image to get the extra $$$, not tough and strong with the look of a rugged mountain goat...

    Please don't think i am having a go at you, as all i am trying to do is inspire a spirited debate, of which i believe i have succeeded in doing, and as i have said before, i have found a lot of your posts to be both informative and inflammatory as well, so keep it up mate...We are both obviously passionate about our rugby and this is a good thing, as i respect your opinions as a player( or ex player) and as a supporter of rugby, so keep it up mate...

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  6. #36
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    Before the love in gets too carried away
    Fairly relevant from Jeff Millers latest Investec Blog entry:

    Author:
    Jeff Miller
    Date Posted:
    12 Feb 2007, 0:00 GMT

    If player salaries were allocated by workload and effort from the first two rounds of the Investec S14, the forwards would be kings and their overpaid teammate backs, the paupers. One thing that stands out more than Phil Kearns's head after the two rounds is the physicality and intensity of the forward clashes. The pick and drive, the truck and trailer, the driving maul and the de-powered scrum engagement are dominating all games.

    A quick tally of try scorers over the weekend shows that the forwards are close to matching their more glamorous team mates in the try scoring stakes. The backs still lead it 14- 10 but that in itself is a telling statistic and enough for the traditionally lower paid forwards to ask for a substantial raise!

    The more effective defensive patterns are making it more difficult to play a wider game so the battle in close and upfront is becoming increasingly dominant. If the trend continues I think it will present some real problems for Australian Rugby. Just think over the weekend how often Lote (Tuquri) handled the ball in an attacking situation (and he is considering a shift back to league) and what about Ben Tune? Maybe a couple of touches but will this be enough to keep quality backs interested in the game in Australia?

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  7. #37
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    Dont worry Frontrow I have pretty thick skin, and I love having the opportunity to nut it out with people like you who are passionate about RUGBY.

    yeah I guess my point just boils down to is this - In the current Australian player market what else could the ARU do? I thought that a fair proportion of the $3.5m would have been 3rd party payments, but I did see Burgs post that this may not be so.

    At the end of the day between the ARU, the Tahs, and 3rd Party $875k is a lot but at the same time is it a lot in Professional sport...

    A lot of factors go into it, and I have a sneaking suspicion one is that he isn't a frontrower and that it's his picture thats taken after the forwards march the ball all the way up the field and the ball is finnally swung wide.

    I do agree that more emphasis needs to be brought around to the front row, how could you not - other wise we'd all watch that other code instead, that dont really need scrums and lineouts.

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  8. #38
    Veteran Contributor frontrow's Avatar
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    Good post Burgs, interesting set of stats...And bring on the next confrontation nick...

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  9. #39
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    Found it, it was more to do with the League offers however would perhaps give an insight into his position on the make up of the ARU offer?

    Sharks chief executive Greg Pierce said he met Ross last week and the club was putting together an offer that would appeal to Tuqiri.

    Given the ARU offered Tuqiri $3 million over fours years, it is understood the Wallabies wing is looking for more than $600,000 a season to return to the NRL.

    It is also understood Tuqiri is keen for the bulk of that offer to come from a club's $3.9 million salary cap, rather than be made up with the uncertainty of sponsorship dollars.

    "The club is still seriously looking at its options and putting a deal together that won't (affect) the cap and still entice Lote to come and play with us," Pierce said.

    "We've still got to comply with the NRL rules and regulations and also not (affect) our salary cap to prevent us from signing other players."

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  10. #40
    Rookie littleleck's Avatar
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    Sounds quite like Lote is keen to up his contract with the Wallabies, if so he can go to League for all i care, I voted him the most overrated player in Aus, and i stand by that.

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  11. #41
    Legend Contributor slomo's Avatar
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    i think its too much cash for a player, whos heart doesn't seem to be in it sometimes!

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  12. #42
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    Well Mckenzie has put the hard word on him for this weekend, basically told him he has to be 100% focused on this game not his negotiations and that big things are expected.

    Apparently Lote has acknowledged that his head hasn't been in it but that he is up for a big game.

    His response on the field is the key for my mind. Will he go out and have a blinder and bring the Tahs home a 4 point win... Love him or hate him but without Wendell they have been missing some firepower in the backs and Lote has to have a big game on the weekend.

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