Scrum Law changes

[Burgs]

From the IRB:

The IRB Council has approved a change to the Law that governs the scrum. This follows a review of the scrum by the IRB Rugby Committee and its Law Project Group following recommendations made by the IRB’s Medical Committee. The Law change will see the implementation of a four stage “crouch, touch, pause, engage” sequence for the initial scrum engagement at all levels of the Game from 1 January, 2007.

Rewrite law 20.1(h) as

The referee will call “crouch” then “touch”. The front rows crouch and using their outside arm each prop touches the point of the opposing prop’s outside shoulder. The props then withdraw their arms. The referee will then call “pause”. Following a pause the referee will then call “engage”. The front rows may then engage. The “engage” call is not a command but an indication that the front rows may come together when ready.

To find out more and view demonstrations of the new Law in practice find the full article here:

http://www.irb.com/EN/Laws+and+Regul...+change+en.htm

[pruc]

dont like it at all.

[Windle]

We'll see how well it works in practice

[frontrow]

As i have indicated before on another thread almost identicle to this one, this law in international rugby and supr 14 or super 6, etc, is really gonna only assist the crappy weak props to look better, ie Baxter. Total farce in my opinion...

[Sagerian]

Does anyone really think it's made a huge difference?

I've seen quite a few games with this new rule enforced, live and on the telly and it's not a big deal.

[RuckNMaul]

Seen games where the props are telling the ref that the gap is to much the ref shakes his head and the props end up on theirs. this will stop that

[frontrow]

When was the last time you played in the frontrow sage. ...It will definately make a difference to the engagement, and Krusher, the props are allowed to stand up and reset if they deem the gap is too large, the ref has a duty of care to let them, otherwise could be seen to be liable in case of a collapse...Any ref with any amount of brains would not let a scrum engage from too far apart for fear of a collapse, and this rule may well make it safer, but i am only pointing out that at Super14 level and above it means you are at the pinnacle of your career and highly experienced and capable( except Baxter) so therefore you should be able to engage as people have been doing for the past 100+ years...Accidents will always happen in rugby, not just in the frontrow, and if this law change helps guide players through thier junior development and club rugby, learning the necessary skills along the way, and meeting the necessary fitness requirements as well, to then be able to play representative rugby, then i wholeheartedly believe this law change will be a benefit in regards to thier safety, but once you are playing at the top level then you should be able to perform under the old laws as previous players have....I can see a problem with this theory in that you grow up with one set of rules, to change at the peak may disadvantage them initially but in the future everyone will have performed under the new laws so no one will truly have an advantage by having played the old laws, therefore everyone will be on an equal footing and having played at the same arms length gap all thier junior years means they would be hesitant to widen it if given the opportunity...
Look, my main complaint regarding this law change is that the implementation of the "Touch" gives players who are mediocre a chance to place thier hand into position prior to engagement meaning that they are already into position on engagement...If you don`t understand, take a look at me old mate Baxter on the European tour, every scrum against Italy, and i mean every scrum, he crouched, held, then upon engagement he immediatlely packed in and instead of going for his grip he placed his hand on the ground for balance then re attempted to establish that grip having lost the initial driving impetus, thus losing ground to the Italian tighthead who murdered him all day...With the new laws his hand will basically be in location immediately prior to engagement therefore taking a part of the challenge/competition out of the engagement

[The InnFORCEr]

And I thought the backs were the smart ones

I see your point Frontrow and I would hazzard to say that is why the law is being introduced from the lower grades up. Should they find it not warrented at the top level it may not be introduced across the board.

[Sagerian]

When was the last time you played in the frontrow sage. ...

It's been a while (never) and that's the response I was expecting hehe, I'm just saying the touch seems to make it easier to line the respective front rows up correctly across the scrum and also distance wise.

I totally get what you're saying about players being at an elite level and that they should know how to set and bind the opposition correctly.

[Burgs]

The whole thing has degenerated over the years, you look at the footage of the 70's and 80's, both packs were basically still forming as the Front Row's hit from fifty paces, yet there were so few injuries. It was in, hit, hook and gone, all over, not this continuous hunt for perfection from Refs today!
If the ball can be gotten by the Scrum Half then play on I reckon, won't change the outcome for the collapsed players.

[pruc]

is this rule for all competitiions. like juniors?

[RuckNMaul]

i think last year and mabey before this rule applied to all under 19 competitions

[frontrow]

This rule has always applied to juniors up to U19s

[Terri]

So what happens when you throw overly long or short arms into the mix?

[Burgs]

That's normal for the front row Terri, they call it a fight

I guess the Ref has to adapt