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Thread: Sunwolves Axed From Super Rugby

  1. #61
    Legend Contributor Alison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyS View Post
    Talk about how to miss the main story!

    Whatever people might think of Robinson, it is very unlikely she just sat down and fabricated a story out of nothing. The point from her story is that what she described is the RA/SANZAR ambition for GRR - they want it to be a second division feeder competition for SR to underpin their economics. Castle is apparently going around and briefing the teams, saying exactly that. So if they don't know it already, the main point GRR and their supporters should be taking away is that any and all involvement by and with SANZAR will have that end goal in mind. There is no philanthropy and there are no 'good rugby men' among them...trust them at all, fail to cover even the most outrageous contingencies, and you will end up as their bitch. Again.
    Personally, I can’t see Twiggy having anything to do with either RA or SANZAAR unless it was 100% on his terms. He’d be looking to squeeze the pips out of them. No way on earth they would be able to play him like they played us.

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  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alison View Post
    Personally, I can’t see Twiggy having anything to do with either RA or SANZAAR unless it was 100% on his terms. He’d be looking to squeeze the pips out of them. No way on earth they would be able to play him like they played us.
    I read it more as an endorsement arrangement than anything more business related. Robinson reporting style and inclination to add in little jibes like calling it a 2nd Div tends to lose a lot of what should be portrayed. Having SANZAAR endorse it essentially removes the last possible hurdle for GRR. By endorsing it SANZAAR is legitimising it in their markets. Most notably in NZ.

    I have a theory here. The Aus and NZ franchises in particular were very vocal about maintaining the Sunwolves in SR. They would not be happy with what's occurring at present. This story is to appease them. The Aus SR franchises have been very keen to grow into the Japanese market. And none of them are too keen on travelling to Sth Africa every year and a number of the NZ franchises are also losing their appetite for the travel. Asia is the future that offers a far greater potential return than where they are at now. This endorsement could be the first tentative steps. Just saying.

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  3. #63
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    Doesn't change the fact that the article would be describing their happy place, or where they see that endorsement leading. They wouldn't be giving it if they didn't see themselves running it.

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  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndyS View Post
    Doesn't change the fact that the article would be describing their happy place, or where they see that endorsement leading. They wouldn't be giving it if they didn't see themselves running it.
    I'm sure there's certainly that thinking among it. The are bankers involved after all. But the key will be the structure GRR is taking which isn't federation based but more shareholding. This should essentially prevent national Unions subversion in attempts to gain control. If GRR gains traction and the opportunity arises for more Aus based participation arises then I actually see it in the form of the individual Unions than RA.

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  5. #65
    Legend Contributor Alison's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WCRugger View Post
    I'm sure there's certainly that thinking among it. The are bankers involved after all. But the key will be the structure GRR is taking which isn't federation based but more shareholding. This should essentially prevent national Unions subversion in attempts to gain control. If GRR gains traction and the opportunity arises for more Aus based participation arises then I actually see it in the form of the individual Unions than RA.
    RA would still have to ‘bless’ their involvement though so they still hold the trump card in the scenario.

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  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alison View Post
    RA would still have to ‘bless’ their involvement though so they still hold the trump card in the scenario.
    RA's ability to influence them may be more limited in the future especially if the restructure of SR doesn't work.

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  7. #67
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    Interesting:
    • Super Rugby season, post 2020: 15 regular rounds (including 2 byes) and 3 finals rounds
    • AFL season, 2019: 23 regular rounds and 5 finals rounds
    • NRL season, 2019: 25 regular rounds and 4 finals rounds
    • A-league season, 2018/2019: 27 regular rounds and 3 finals rounds
    • Super Netball season, 2019: 14 regular rounds (interrupted by a 4 week break for the NWC) and 3 finals rounds

    Post 2020, each Australian SR franchise will play 13 home games every 2 years (currently 16 home games every 2 years), 2 Australian home derbies every 2 years and 1 home derby in the alternate year (currently 3 Australian home derbies every year).

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    Last edited by FingerTips; 22-03-19 at 17:54.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by FingerTips View Post
    Interesting:
    • Super Rugby season, post 2020: 15 regular rounds (including 2 byes) and 2 finals rounds
    • AFL season, 2019: 23 regular rounds and 5 finals rounds
    • NRL season, 2019: 25 regular rounds and 4 finals rounds
    • A-league season, 2018/2019: 27 regular rounds and 3 finals rounds
    • Super Netball season, 2019: 14 regular rounds (interrupted by a 4 week break for the NWC) and 3 finals rounds

    Post 2020, each Australian SR franchise will play 13 home games every 2 years (currently 16 home games every 2 years), 2 Australian home derbies every 2 years and 1 home derby in the alternate year (currently 3 Australian home derbies every year).
    Yep. Complete stupidity. Which is why murmurs of a reworked NRC during the RC window is promising.

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  9. #69
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    how can they expect to earn such big salaries when they only play 13 x 80 minutes of game time - compared with AFL ?

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  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by WCRugger View Post
    Yep. Complete stupidity. Which is why murmurs of a reworked NRC during the RC window is promising.
    Alternatively, unsubstantiated murmurs suggest that if the ARU/RA's cash flow projections for 2020/2021 get any worse, then things like the NRC may have to be shut down in order to preserve cash.

    BTW, certain Illuminati in the Moore Park bunker are getting bored with people in the NSWRU and QRU who constantly remind them about the large pile of Mr Forrest's money which the ARU/RA left on a table.

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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by volvo View Post
    Western Force throw Japanese Sunwolves a bone in new competition
    Nick TaylorThe West Australian
    Thursday, 21 March 2019 10:33AM



    Meanwhile, a GRR spokesman has rubbished claims that secret SANZAAR plans will see GRR become part of an Asian Super Rugby style competition, partly-owned by mining magnate Andrew Forrest.

    A report says the concept has been part of RA chief executive Raelene Castle's briefings to Super Rugby clubs.

    "The story is a figment of someone’s imagination," the GRR spokesman said.

    "Global Rapid Rugby is not part of a secret Asian Super Rugby plan. The story is incorrect."


    https://thewest.com.au/sport/western...ng-b881141859z
    Well, maybe Andy Marino forgot to to talk to Twiggy or Hodgo these pipe dream options:

    “We have presented options to them around the establishment of a Super Rugby Asia Pacific competition structure including Japan, the Pacific Islands, North and South America and Hong Kong.""

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  12. #72
    Immortal Contributor shasta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FingerTips View Post
    BTW, certain Illuminati in the Moore Park bunker are getting bored with people in the NSWRU and QRU who constantly remind them about the large pile of Mr Forrest's money which the ARU/RA left on a table.
    Is there any word from the Lindfield brigade on whether the Eastwood/Randwick insurgency is getting any traction?

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  13. #73
    Immortal GIGS20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WCRugger View Post
    The Aus SR franchises have been very keen to grow into the Japanese market. And none of them are too keen on travelling to Sth Africa every year and a number of the NZ franchises are also losing their appetite for the travel. Asia is the future that offers a far greater potential return than where they are at now. This endorsement could be the first tentative steps. Just saying.
    The Aus Super franchises are keen on keeping a Japanese team not for financial reasons, but because they see it as a game they can win. They know that Aussie sports fans love a winner, but walk away from mediocrity.

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    C'mon the

  14. #74
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    And now it's being reported that SNZAFU , after axing the Sunwolves, because they refuse to pay $12m extortion, are forcing them to play next year. Apparently to honour the TV rights. Which didn't stop them axing the Force using altered TV rights as the legal pretext. Sunwolves won't be able to sign anyone to a 1 year deal post World Cup.

    You can't make this shit up

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  15. #75
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    A local angle from Kyodo News...

    Rugby: Sunwolves' demise may lead to new dawn for Japanese rugby

    By Rich Freeman, KYODO NEWS
    March 23, 2019 - 14:40 |

    On the face of it, the axing of the Sunwolves from Super Rugby was simply a case of too much money demanded, or a belief that the tournament was not the right road for Japan to pursue.

    But delve deeper and it appears that political intrigue was at the heart of the decision that sent shockwaves through the rugby world.

    It appears not only were certain members of the Japan Rugby Football Union clearly doing all they could to ensure the Sunwolves would be no more, but factions within Super Rugby organizers SANZAAR put long-standing grudges ahead of any attempts to help spread rugby through Asia, the continent that will host this year's World Cup.

    Friday's press release and press conference from SANZAAR and the JRFU were both fairly diplomatic, but it was obvious there was a difference in opinion.

    SANZAAR said the problem was the JRFU's inability to meet certain financial requirements, this despite the governing body of the sport in the Southern Hemisphere asking on a number of occasions for the Japan Super Rugby Association to distance itself from those in charge of the game in Japan.

    The JRFU, meanwhile, said the fee demanded from it was unreasonable and "non-negotiable," and as a result, according to SANZAAR, they opted to pursue other ways to develop the Japanese national team.

    Kyodo News, however, has learned that political fighting was at the heart of the matter and the result could see a revolution in Japanese rugby, courtesy of marketing giant Dentsu Inc., who bought out CSM, one of the leading rugby agents in New Zealand.

    As far as the money is concerned, multiple sources have told Kyodo that the JRFU were being asked to provide a $5 million participation fee, pay $2 million in travel expenses and forego broadcast rights that could have brought in a further $2 million, none of which applies to the other 14 teams in the competition.

    "It was not that we were unwilling to underwrite the Sunwolves, we just couldn't agree the financial terms presented to us by SANZAAR with other demands on our budget," JRFU Chairman Noriyuki Sakamoto said.

    The payment demand was also not mentioned in previous discussions about extending the Sunwolves' Super Rugby tenure, despite any changes to the tournament agreement needing to be unanimously supported by member federations.

    According to one source, the New Zealand and Australian federations, which until the end of 2018 had been fully supportive of the Sunwolves, had gone silent in recent months and have finally been won over by their South African counterparts.

    The South African authorities and teams have long expressed their displeasure with the Sunwolves, in part because they believed the Japanese side was not contributing financially. Though the benefits that came from the influx of cash from the numerous Japanese companies that sponsor Super Rugby sides outside of Japan was often conveniently ignored.

    From the outset, concerns were raised about the flight times from South Africa to Tokyo, with the result that the Sunwolves have had to play three games a year in Singapore, where crowds are next to nonexistent.

    However, it was the anger of the South African Rugby Union at three decisions made by a JRFU representative -- known to be opposed, along with other senior members of the union, to the concept of the Sunwolves -- that really upset the apple cart.

    Not only did Japan vote for France, and against South Africa, to be the host of Rugby World Cup 2023 but a source has confirmed that on two occasions the same JRFU official voted against the South African candidate hoping to join the World Rugby Council.

    With any support for a Japanese team evaporating, it appears alternative plans were drawn up in Tokyo, leading SANZAAR to say that, as far as it is concerned, "The future of the Sunwolves will now be determined by the JRFU which has determined that Super Rugby no longer remains the best pathway for the development of players for the national team."

    Kyodo News has learned that this alternative pathway could involve a new club rugby competition run by Dentsu with the support of CSM and the players it manages.

    Numerous sources have said that sponsors, TV rights and peripheral companies involved in putting on major events are all on board and that the tournament could involve not only established and newly-created Japanese teams but a number of sides from overseas.

    When asked recently about the proposed competition, Sakamoto initially refused to comment, before adding, "We have heard the rumor, but nothing official. If anyone wants to play rugby in Japan they need our approval."

    If such a league were to be set up and run from January to June, ensuring Japan's top players are ready to take part in World Rugby's proposed Nations Championship, it could see a host of players currently playing for SANZAAR teams move full time to Japan in search of bigger paydays.

    In a twist of fate to match any political thriller, it could be that SANZAAR's axing of the Sunwolves may end up being the catalyst that breaks up the sporting body, rather than strengthening its own competition.

    Whether Japanese administrators have the wherewithal to run such a competition, however, given its union's members are so clearly out of touch with modern rugby -- not to mention the JRFU's motto of "One for all, all for one" -- remains to be seen.

    One thing is for sure, though, the real losers are the players, coaches, administrators, and most of all the Sunwolves' fans who, rather than being duty-bound to a company team, finally had one to which they could choose to pledge their allegiance.

    It is those fans who will suffer the most for having been caught up in the middle of all this nonsense.

    https://english.kyodonews.net/news/2...mGj2myCQSAcH04

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