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Thread: INVICTUS

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    Player SleazyWineBaas's Avatar
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    INVICTUS

    Watching the Kiwis choke on the big screen was epic
    And not a mention of Suzi
    Clint Eastwood hates pussies

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    Champion lara93's Avatar
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    it was a good movie!!

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    BOKKE
    “Let me put it this way, A Springbok team contains Afrikaners, Englishmen, coloureds and blacks. It has parochial foes in Bulls, Sharks, Stormers, Cheetahs and Lions. It is a recipe for war! Yet in all the years of John Smit’s captaincy, there has never been one unhappy customer, not one voice of rebellion against his leadership. He is the glue that holds the Springboks together. The man is a legend!”- Jake White

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    Saw it last night. Enjoyed it. Mainly about how Mandela was clever enough to use the opportunity of the Rugby world cup to unite black and white South Africans. Morgan Freeman was very beliveable as Mandela and Matt Damon played Pineaar. He looked like he had bulked up abit to play a rugby player. Of course the Wallabies lost at the quarter finals! That didn't change!

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    Legend Contributor blueandblack's Avatar
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    Any actual south africans in the movie?

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    Quote Originally Posted by PerthGirl View Post
    Saw it last night. Enjoyed it. Mainly about how Mandela was clever enough to use the opportunity of the Rugby world cup to unite black and white South Africans. Morgan Freeman was very beliveable as Mandela and Matt Damon played Pineaar. He looked like he had bulked up abit to play a rugby player. Of course the Wallabies lost at the quarter finals! That didn't change!
    What you didn't get the subtext about how Mandela was just using the World Cup as a cover so he could build his doomsday device without anyone noticing?

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    Insert evil laugh?

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    Invictus not averse to playing with facts

    Invictus not averse to playing with facts

    * by Wayne Smith
    * From: The Australian
    * January 25, 2010 12:00AM


    IT's a bit self-defeating for a critic to point out there is one minor thing wrong about the Clint Eastwood-directed movie Invictus - that this "true story" about the 1995 Rugby World Cup is actually based on a falsehood.

    In the movie, Nelson Mandela, newly elected as president of South Africa after having been imprisoned for 27 years by the apartheid government, presents Springbok captain Francois Pienaar on the eve of the World Cup with a copy of the William Henley poem Invictus that helped sustain him during his long years in jail on Robben Island.

    It's true that the poem, best known for its stirring conclusion, "I am the master of my fate; I am the captain of my soul", did provide much solace to Mandela on the island. But it wasn't Invictus that he gave to Pienaar just before the tournament. Rather, it was Theodore Roosevelt's The Man in the Arena.

    The self-defeating part of all this from the perspective of a nitpicking journalist is that this Roosevelt speech begins by putting smart arses like me in their place: "It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better," it states. "The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming."

    So, having been shown the error of my fault-finding ways, let's move on to the film itself, a rare Hollywood excursion into rugby.

    Invictus is being marketed as one of the most inspiring movies of the year. But if you go along to the cinema expecting to be inspired and you are, but not as much as you thought you would be, does that not make the overall experience mildly deflating?

    The key actors are compellingly convincing. Morgan Freeman looks more like Mandela than Mandela himself, while Matt Damon, commendably beefed up to fit the role of a knuckle-dragging Springbok flanker and sensibly underplaying the harsh South African accent, does Pienaar proud.

    What's disappointing is that the same care that went into the casting of the two principals wasn't extended to selecting the supporting cast of Springboks. Surely in all of South Africa it cannot have been difficult to find a dozen or so more convincing rugby players.

    It is not as though members of the Royal Shakespearean company were needed to handle the theatrical demands placed on the actors playing the Springboks. Basically, all that was required of them was to stand around looking racist. Granted, they handled this to generally good effect.

    But while the rugby scenes were well shot and would have given US moviegoers in particular an insight into what football without the body armour is really like, they still did not do justice to the pace, intensity and ferocity of genuine Test rugby.

    In one scene in which a Western Samoan defender takes out a Springbok player with a marginally late hit, the tackle is portrayed as fairly hard. In fact, there is nothing fair about ever being tackled by the Samoans. They hit not just to hurt but to rearrange every bone in your body.

    What was almost laugh-out-loud funny about the movie was that the Springbok players threw the ball around like the Barbarians. In fact, then, as now, the South Africans kicked like mules and with about as much subtlety. Indeed, the core tactic they employed in their tournament-opening victory over Australia in 1995 was to constantly hoof the ball over the dead-ball line, pinning the Wallabies in their own territory by repeatedly forcing them to drop out from their 22.

    By far the most glaring, if understandable, omission from the movie is that no mention is made whatever of the famous All Black claim that they were poisoned by a South African waitress, Suzie, two days before playing the Boks in the World Cup final.

    Granted, it's not difficult to understand why Eastwood sidestepped the ongoing controversy of whether Suzie, supposedly bribed by a gambling syndicate, seasoned the New Zealanders' meals with something a little stronger than garlic and thyme.

    After all, it's a little tricky to sustain the storyline of an heroic, against-all-odds Springbok victory while also entertaining the notion that South Africa might have nobbled their opponents. Still, I'm not expecting Invictus to be a box office smash hit in NZ.

    Yet for all the glaring omissions, there were some glaring inclusions as well for those familiar with the Mandela story. Quite literally so, in one case.

    In the scene where Mandela invites Pienaar to tea with him, he motions to the Springbok captain to sit in a particular chair so that he himself does not have to look into the light. Anyone who has read Long Walk to Freedom would recall that for years on Robben Island Mandela was forced to work in the quarry without sunglasses to protect his eyes from the glare of the sun reflecting off the lime.

    No reference is made to why Mandela's eyes are so sensitive. The scene isn't laboured in any way by the director. But by liberally sprinkling the movie with such realistic touches, Eastwood goes a long way to building the overall credibility of Invictus.

    That's important because the unembellished history of those times border on the incredible. To think that a man imprisoned for so long would not only forgive his Afrikaaner jailers but then actually use their secular religion, rugby - the brutish sport of a brutish people, as one commentator put it - to help unify the Rainbow Nation, strains credulity all on its own, let alone once Hollywood has schmaltzed up the facts. Still, it's hard to get overly excited by any movie that has as its happy ending a Springbok World Cup triumph.

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1225823043863

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    Player SleazyWineBaas's Avatar
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    Take some solace from visuallising a kiwi mental disintegration on wide angle
    As a rugby fan, it is the greatest rugby movie of all time.
    The casting went to great lengths to select all players involved to resemble the real men. Even in the snippets of other games it is easy to recognise Tim Horan, John Eales and co

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    Veteran zimeric's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by travelling_gerry View Post
    it's hard to get overly excited by any movie that has as its happy ending a Springbok World Cup triumph.
    Depends on whether or not you are a one eyed, nit picking journo or a lover of a good story..

    Ive never supported the boks, but regardless of the whole food spiking conspiracy the boks HAD to win that world cup...it was their destiny!

    ---------- Post added at 08:00 ---------- Previous post was at 07:50 ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by blueandblack View Post
    Any actual south africans in the movie?

    the ones highlights are definitely South African.. there may be others with more "worldly" names that could also be South African though.. I'd be surprised if there were more than 10 cast that werent.

    Cast (in credits order)

    Morgan Freeman ... Nelson Mandela
    Matt Damon ... Francois Pienaar
    Tony Kgoroge ... Jason Tshabalala
    Patrick Mofokeng ... Linga Moonsamy
    Matt Stern ... Hendrick Booyens
    Julian Lewis Jones ... Etienne Feyder
    Adjoa Andoh ... Brenda Mazibuko
    Marguerite Wheatley ... Nerine
    Leleti Khumalo ... Mary
    Patrick Lyster ... Mr. Pienaar
    Penny Downie ... Mrs. Pinnear
    Sibongile Nojila ... Eunice
    Bonnie Henna ... Zindzi
    Shakes Myeko ... Minister of Sport
    Louis Minnaar ... Springbok Coach
    Danny Keogh ... Rugby President
    Dan Robbertse ... Boer
    Robin Smith ... Johan De Villiers
    David Dukas ... Captain of 747
    Grant Swanby ... Co-Captain of 747
    Josias Moleele ... Face Painter
    Langley Kirkwood ... Presidential Guard
    Robert Hobbs ... Presidential Guard
    Melusi Yeni ... Presidential Guard
    Vuyo Dabula ... Presidential Guard
    Daniel Hadebe ... Presidential Guard
    Jodi Botha ... High School Boy
    Henie Bosman ... High School Coach
    Refiloe Mpakanyane ... Jessie
    Jakkie Groenewald ... Johannesburg Cop
    Murray Todd ... Johannesburg Cop
    Japan Mthembu ... Local Cop
    Albert Maritz ... Sprinbok Mranage
    Sello Motloung ... Mandela's Doctor
    Meren Reddy ... Minister of the Environment
    Lida Botha ... Mrs. Brits
    Susan Danford ... Mrs. Cole
    Sylvia Mngxekeza ... Mrs. Dlamini
    James Lithgow ... New Zealand PM
    Malusi Skenjana ... NSC Firebird
    Bart Fouche ... Prison Guard
    Johnny Cicco ... Staff Member
    Wayne Harrison ... Staff Member
    Ashley Taylor ... Team Crew
    Gift Leotlela ... Team Crew
    Kgosi Mongake ... Sipho
    Given Stuurman ... Township Kid
    Vuyolwethu Stevens ... Township Kid
    Ayabulela Steven ... Township Kid
    Nambitha Mpumlwana ... Trophy Wife
    Andre Jacobs ... Television Announcer
    Scott Eastwood ... South African Springbok
    Grant Roberts ... South African Springbok
    Mark Bown-Davies ... South African Springbok
    Dale Stephen Dunn ... South African Springbok
    Graham Lindemann ... Kobus Wiese
    Andries Le Grange ... South African Springbok
    Clive Richard Samuel ... South African Springbok
    Richard Abrahamse ... South African Springbok
    Sean Pypers ... South African Springbok
    Riaan Wolmarans ... South African Springbok
    Ryan Scott ... South African Springbok
    Daniel Deon Wessels ... South African Springbok
    Vaughn Thompson ... South African Springbok
    Charl Engelbrecht ... South African Springbok
    Rolf E. Fitschen ... South African Springbok (as Rolf Ernst Fitschen)
    Andrew Nel ... South African Springbok
    Rudi Zandberg ... South African Springbok
    Abraham Vlok ... South African Springbok
    rest of cast listed alphabetically:
    Zak Feaunati ... Jonah Lomu
    Sean Cameron Michael ... Springbok Equipment Manager (uncredited)
    Matthew Dylan Roberts ... Cabinet minister (uncredited)
    Patrick Walton Jr. ... Springbok Trainer (uncredited)

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    I think it would have been great to use some of the original players,maybe with a bit of hair dye and other special hollywood effects to make them look younger,then they could have used some of the real footage for the final.
    The actors they used werent real convincing looking players,nor were the rugby games scenes.

    Or at least they could have used the real jonah since he is still running around.

    I agree that it will never be a smash hit in nz, but then they are a fanatical rugby nation, and it has been 15 years now.

    Really enjoyed the insight into mandela the man, he is very clever.The movie has only increased my respect for him.

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    "IT's a bit self-defeating for a critic to point out there is one minor thing wrong about the Clint Eastwood-directed movie Invictus - that this "true story" about the 1995 Rugby World Cup is actually based on a falsehood."

    Sounds like some of Waynes own work.

    "I'd be surprised if there were more than 10 cast that werent."

    Not Zims claimed by South Africans until they can be replaced Zimeric

    "I agree that it will never be a smash hit in nz, but then they are a fanatical rugby nation, and it has been 15 years now."

    Two words Cookie, "Trevor Chappell"

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    Veteran Swee_82's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Burgs View Post
    [I]

    Two words Cookie, "Trevor Chappell"
    Touche'

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    to be honest, from the ads on telly, damon looks more like that Juan smit person

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    Senior Player antiussentiment's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by force addict View Post
    to be honest, from the ads on telly, damon looks more like that Juan smit person
    that had not occured to me.. but i have to agree. just allot smaller ~laughs~

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    cheers auss...
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    Champion Contributor jazza93's Avatar
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    Invictus was good to watch but was not the rugby movie i was hoping for.

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