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Thread: O'Connor to become Force's young general

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    Champion Tazzmania's Avatar
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    O'Connor to become Force's young general

    Looks like JOC will be full back this year:

    Teenage Wallaby star James O'Connor is being backed by coach John Mitchell to step into the leadership hole left in the Western Force backline by Matt Giteau – but not his position.

    Back on the training track today in the build up to their trial tour to South Africa later this month, the Force's Wallaby contingent including Nathan Sharpe and Matt Dunning were getting used to Super 14 surroundings again – as well as acclimatising to a playing group minus some marquee players.

    With Giteau and Drew Mitchell gone, amongst others, the former New Zealand coach has admitted he will have to modify tactics with different personnel in 2010 – with a harder, stronger edge and more kicking likely from new flyhalf André Pretorius.

    And that will leave O'Connor to roam free from full back – where Mitchell says he believes one of the hottest prospects in world rugby will prosper and influence the Force attacking threat.

    "We are looking a lot stronger … it does not mean our attacking style will go out of the window, we will have to get the balance between that and kicking," Mitchell said.

    "We have not ignored our run but clearly we have made some real big gains in our strength, and all our players with lower limb limitations … are all progressing.

    "I think he (O'Connor) will naturally become a leader through his experiences of Test rugby in 09, and enduring and learning a new position. He was constantly under pressure from the high ball,

    "But he exudes confidence, and it is important for him to continue to be himself and just play. It will be horses for courses with him, but we will probably get started at 15 with him. He has played a lot of last year at that position."

    "But he will want to grow his game – it is a matter of fact he will gain leadership through experience.

    A year to the day that Mitchell returned to the Force facing a potentially ruinous mutiny from players unhappy with his coaching style, the Force appear to be an entirely cohesive club – with senior sources within squad commenting on how united preparations have been.

    Mitchell said new recruits on and off the field, with former Wallabies skills coach Richard Graham, had reinvigorated the club.

    "It is refreshing, new coaching group, new players, experienced players that want to learn, younger players that want to have a crack and have seen other younger players go on and play Super 14 and Test rugby," Mitchell said.

    "Before Christmas, during the pre-season which can be laborious, and enduring and unstimulating, they turned up every day with a great attitude which is a really great sign.

    "The next 15 days is a different challenge because there is a lot of knowledge that has to get put in, in terms of plays and defensive systems, it is a big learning time."

    And the Force hope to learn whether Kiwi hooker Jamie Parsons, 23, could join the squad, after arriving from Auckland club North Harbour for five-day trial.




    O'Connor to become Force's young general

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    Simon Cron: “People talk about winning and losing all the time and they are critical, but there’s a process to get into and it’s the ability to stay present, do your job and execute skills under pressure.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tazzmania View Post
    And the Force hope to learn whether Kiwi hooker Jamie Parsons, 23, could join the squad, after arriving from Auckland club North Harbour for five-day trial.
    Very interesting.

    Against the Tyrone Smith and Ma'a Nonu having JOC at 12 would be a touch suicidal. I'd really like to see him return to 12 when Nick Cummins comes back though.

    Anyone have the downlow on Jamie Parsons? Or should I start trawling the web?

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    That is probably a good call James, keep him at 15 until Cummins comes back.

    Regarding Parsons, I have asked the question of kiwis over at planet rugby - http://forum.planet-rugby.com/index....78996&start=0&

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    Champion Tazzmania's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Very interesting.

    Against the Tyrone Smith and Ma'a Nonu having JOC at 12 would be a touch suicidal. I'd really like to see him return to 12 when Nick Cummins comes back though.

    Anyone have the downlow on Jamie Parsons? Or should I start trawling the web?
    I have put in another thread see James parson New Force hooker

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    Simon Cron: “People talk about winning and losing all the time and they are critical, but there’s a process to get into and it’s the ability to stay present, do your job and execute skills under pressure.”

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    still have my doubts with him under the high ball as corey jane easily beat him in the air to score a try, he's not that tall.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cookie View Post
    still have my doubts with him under the high ball as corey jane easily beat him in the air to score a try, he's not that tall.
    It was a pretty average contest but you can't judge him on the basis of that one alone. I remember when he lined up against the Chiefs in 2008 and they sent heaps of high balls his way and he was very solid.

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    Champion Contributor sandgroperrugby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cookie View Post
    still have my doubts with him under the high ball as corey jane easily beat him in the air to score a try, he's not that tall.
    Height has little to do with it, commitment on the other hand well that flat out wins the contest! IMHO

    See how many high balls Will Genia won on the spring tour this way!

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    Champion Rex Messup's Avatar
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    I think JOC will prove to be one of Australia's greatest players with time
    I think he was badly exposed at 15 in the tri nations tests. The kiwis targeted him with kicks and frequently found him out of position. He looked sus under the high ball.
    In contrast, I think he is a very good defender in the frontline. He's very tough and very courageous.
    He's also a sensational attacking player and brings real menace to our midfield attack. he wants to play 12. Pick him at 12
    "Hiding" him at 15 doesn't work for me. I think he's wasted
    he's one of those players you want to get the ball in his hands at every opportunity.
    Shep is a proven test fullback. If it aint broke, don't fix it

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    That kid as our last line of defence, oh dear.

    Stick him on the wing and let him float into the action from time to time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sandgroperrugby View Post
    Height has little to do with it, commitment on the other hand well that flat out wins the contest! IMHO

    See how many high balls Will Genia won on the spring tour this way!
    he didnt compete for the ball, his feet were planted firmly on the ground when Jane sailed over the top, that aint how he should be doing it especially if under pressure like he was

    Quote Originally Posted by Rex Messup View Post
    I think JOC will prove to be one of Australia's greatest players with time
    I think he was badly exposed at 15 in the tri nations tests. The kiwis targeted him with kicks and frequently found him out of position. He looked sus under the high ball.
    In contrast, I think he is a very good defender in the frontline. He's very tough and very courageous.
    He's also a sensational attacking player and brings real menace to our midfield attack. he wants to play 12. Pick him at 12
    "Hiding" him at 15 doesn't work for me. I think he's wasted
    he's one of those players you want to get the ball in his hands at every opportunity.
    Shep is a proven test fullback. If it aint broke, don't fix it
    i agree, the way the game is heading with the kicking domination, 15 is really only there to catch and kick the ball, there arent to many attacking raids launched from the back these days, even in set plays the 15 is really just the finisher and not the playmaker. Better off getting JOC in closer to the action IMO.

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    I'm abit confused why play O'Connor at fullback now then when Nick Cummins returns play him as a 12. Last Time I checked Cummins plays wing and he will probably miss half the season...
    O'Connor will struggle as a 12 against those players mentioned and he also struggles as a fullback in general. I'm not sure why he is being talked up so much at the moment...
    I'D rather Cameron Shepherd at fullback with Sare and Haylett-Petty on the wings and put O'Connor on the bench.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jjk View Post
    I'm abit confused why play O'Connor at fullback now then when Nick Cummins returns play him as a 12. Last Time I checked Cummins plays wing and he will probably miss half the season...
    O'Connor will struggle as a 12 against those players mentioned and he also struggles as a fullback in general. I'm not sure why he is being talked up so much at the moment...
    I'D rather Cameron Shepherd at fullback with Sare and Haylett-Petty on the wings and put O'Connor on the bench.
    Because in the first two weeks he would be lining up against two of the biggest inside centres in the competition and we have fewer options in the outside backs (with Cummins out and Shep not 100%) than with the inside backs at the moment. When Cummins is back Shepherd can move to 15 and JOC can move to 12.

    I don't think you can really judge O'Connor's Super 14 on what he is like in Tests. The Force aren't going to be beated nearly as badly as the Wallabies were by the Blacks and the Boks. We'll just have to wait and see.

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    to be fair 2 of my favourite fullbacks chritian cullen and mils muliaina are not very tall but are great positional players and are very skillful, they know when to inject themselves into the backline and hit the ball at pace,joc has potential but has a fair way to go.

    Sheps and latham are 2 other favourites

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    James, you have made some good points but I'm just thinking if you are going to start the season with O'Connor at fullback then leave him there and let the other guys build up combinations. I also don't like having to change the whole team around because of one guy.
    I think at this stage in his career and probably for the next 4 to 5 years O'Connor's best position is probably 15.
    Isn't it good that we are talking about rugby again?

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    If JOC plays at fullback, who will be 12? Josh Tatupu? Sam Harris? Mitch Inman?

    My concern about not playing O'Connor at 12 is that we don't have a very creative 10. If we have centres who just charge at the line, we will not end end being very creative in attack. We'll end up playing games like South African teams - booting the ball upfield and relying on our forwards (who are good but as has been said, not the best in the comp).

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