Subi Stadium Dramas + Beer etc

[htbd]

I am not sure if this has been raised before but I just gotta say it…
How bad is Subiaco Stadium as a rugby venue??
And does anybody know when the move will take place to a new rectangular stadium? (As formerly promised…)

I love the fact that rugby is making inroads into WA, and that people who know nothing about the game are making a genuine positive effort to understand the game and get behind their team. However, I find it highly frustrating that within the people that I know I have found there to be a frighteningly large proportion of 1st timers who have vowed not to renew their membership – not because of the quality of the rugby (or supporters!) but the lack of value of the membership. Citing that it’s almost impossible to get a feel for the game as it’s so far away! What a shame if we lose all these (formerly positive and optimistic) supporters due to Subi being one of the worst grounds to watch a rugby game at!

I was in Wellington last month to watch the Canes play at the cake tin and it really rammed it home to me the importance of an appropriate, close nit stadium as it adds a great deal to the game and atmosphere.

Also, as an aside – all the beer was sold in plastic screw-top bottles at $5 a pop. Which made for super fast processing times (in terms of queues and monetary transactions (i.e. $20 note for 4 beers as opposed to buying a tray of poured beers in cups, waiting for it to be poured, having to find an uneven amount of lose change, spilling the beer on the way back, only having mid-strength etc)). It was fantastic - I had purchased a round of drinks and was back in my seat in less than 2 minutes – I also really liked the fact that the physical space between each stadium seat is larger so that no one needed to stand up to clear the aisle when I went!

There is so much money in Perth I know that we can do better! C’mon!

Sorry to be so negative, but I really want rugby to succeed in Perth and I know how much more value would be added if there was an appropriate venue… Is there anything we can do to help progress this?

[The EnForcer]

I am not sure if this has been raised before but I just gotta say it…
How bad is Subiaco Stadium as a rugby venue??
And does anybody know when the move will take place to a new rectangular stadium? (As formerly promised…)

I love the fact that rugby is making inroads into WA, and that people who know nothing about the game are making a genuine positive effort to understand the game and get behind their team. However, I find it highly frustrating that within the people that I know I have found there to be a frighteningly large proportion of 1st timers who have vowed not to renew their membership – not because of the quality of the rugby (or supporters!) but the lack of value of the membership. Citing that it’s almost impossible to get a feel for the game as it’s so far away! What a shame if we lose all these (formerly positive and optimistic) supporters due to Subi being one of the worst grounds to watch a rugby game at!

I was in Wellington last month to watch the Canes play at the cake tin and it really rammed it home to me the importance of an appropriate, close nit stadium as it adds a great deal to the game and atmosphere.

Also, as an aside – all the beer was sold in plastic screw-top bottles at $5 a pop. Which made for super fast processing times (in terms of queues and monetary transactions (i.e. $20 note for 4 beers as opposed to buying a tray of poured beers in cups, waiting for it to be poured, having to find an uneven amount of lose change, spilling the beer on the way back, only having mid-strength etc)). It was fantastic - I had purchased a round of drinks and was back in my seat in less than 2 minutes – I also really liked the fact that the physical space between each stadium seat is larger so that no one needed to stand up to clear the aisle when I went!

There is so much money in Perth I know that we can do better! C’mon!

Sorry to be so negative, but I really want rugby to succeed in Perth and I know how much more value would be added if there was an appropriate venue… Is there anything we can do to help progress this?

Has been said before but worth raising again I reckon. I don't think many will argue with you any of your points from this site.

As far as the problem with getting served drink quickly is concerned they are not going to address that cause the powers that be believe that we are not responsible enough to moderate our own drinking, so they do it for us. BS huh.

I'm sure Coach will agree that once we get the membership up a bit we may well have an influence on some of these issues but until then we have to lump it I'm afraid.

[htbd]

Thanks for that EnForcer...
Are you able to tell me whatever happed to the golden 25 MILLION dollar promise that was going to go towards the upgrade of Members Equity Stadium by 2007?

[Mambo No. 5]

Egan is the best man to answer that which I think was done in an earlier thread. Try searching for "Members Equity".

[shasta]

Good question and welcome. I'm a semi-regular 6PR/ABC sports talk listener and the future of our stadia has been a hot topic for quite some time. I'm not sure where it sits at the moment only that there is a committee headed by someone called Langulant investigating. Originally the WA Govt committed to upgrade Members equity to seat 25,000 (iirc?). Presently, AFAIK, the WAFC is opposing any new multi-purpose stadium and says they want to stay at Subiaco. The AFL's attitude according to Andrew Dimetriou is that they run football and they'll decide where it's played. Arrogant prick! I say let 'em go for it but don't ask for any tax-payers money to upgrade Subi - let the AFL fund it.

There is a proposal to build a multi purpose stadium with train/bus station and heaps of parking at Cockburn. I favour this one - though I have to admit I live in Mandurah so that may sway me a little But seriously, I don't think upgrading ME to 25000 is going to cut it once The Force start winning.

What can we do about it? Start ringing talk back radio, write to The Force management, your local pollie or anyone else with a bit of influence when decision time comes. There are some powerful vested interests in the media in WA and very few of them are in the business of promoting Rugby or Football (soccer). They might say publicly that there's room for all sports in WA but privately they'll do all they can to keep WA kids only interested in Aussie Rules. If we are not heard we may get shafted. And your dead right about Subi - it's just as bad as the WACA - just bigger.

[The EnForcer]

Good question and welcome. I'm a semi-regular 6PR/ABC sports talk listener and the future of our stadia has been a hot topic for quite some time. I'm not sure where it sits at the moment only that there is a committee headed by someone called Langulant investigating. Originally the WA Govt committed to upgrade Members equity to seat 25,000 (iirc?). Presently, AFAIK, the WAFC is opposing any new multi-purpose stadium and says they want to stay at Subiaco. The AFL's attitude according to Andrew Dimetriou is that they run football and they'll decide where it's played. Arrogant prick! I say let 'em go for it but don't ask for any tax-payers money to upgrade Subi - let the AFL fund it.

Yeah, and the money they are talking about to raise the seating capacity at Subi to circa 60K is about the same as it would be to build a new multi purpose stadium.....arrogant pricks is bloody right mate.

Why on earth would we want to create an even bigger rabbit warren than it is already. New stadium all the way and keep well clear of the AFL mafia.

[shasta]

Even within AFL interests there is a quetion of equity for all here. Should the WCE and Dockers be allowed to sell all available seats to any of their matches or should there always be a number of seats available for public sale? Most of us pay tax but not all of us support either of these two teams. The arrogance of the WAFC and the AFL in this matter is staggering. Move over or get out of the way, I say.

[Burgs]

I must admit to coming from as biased a position as you are with the Cockburn option shasta, but I would love to see the new stadium built on the soon to be vacated Claremont Football Oval.
It is central to all of the inner city Rugby Clubs (and you would assume their players and supporters), it is on the rail with a dedicated station (Showgrounds), it has oceans of parking next door at the Royal Showgrounds, it has good road access to the north, to WAIS and to Fremantle and it is in a City Council that could part fund it. The Royal Ag could operate several Members Bars on restricted hours in their existing Bar and Pavilions and the average punter is ten to twenty minutes away from pubs in Claremont, Cottesloe, Subiaco, Perth or Fremantle by train.

[The InnFORCEr]

I must admit to coming from as biased a position as you are with the Cockburn option shasta, but I would love to see the new stadium built on the soon to be vacated Claremont Football Oval.
It is central to all of the inner city Rugby Clubs (and you would assume their players and supporters), it is on the rail with a dedicated station (Showgrounds), it has oceans of parking next door at the Royal Showgrounds, it has good road access to the north, to WAIS and to Fremantle and it is in a City Council that could part fund it. The Royal Ag could operate several Members Bars on restricted hours in their existing Bar and Pavilions and the average punter is ten to twenty minutes away from pubs in Claremont, Cottesloe, Subiaco, Perth or Fremantle by train.

Never thought of it, but what a fantastic idea, would create something like the Tahs have at Fox Studios (was Ag Soc land I believe as well) adjoining Aussie Stadium........the best solution I have heard yet.....plus Burgs can still put the big bulls etc on display later in the year!

[shasta]

That one's out of left field Burgs. Or at least I've not heard it canvassed before. It may be central to some of the loder rugby clubs in the Western Suburbs, but Perth has changed a lot since the days when Neddies, Cott, Wests etc were formed. I'm afraid Claremont would be awkward for lots of us.

George Grljusic - a pro Cockburn advocate who, unbiased aas always, lives in Spearwood - has been quoting some urban growth stats that have Cockburn as the centre of greater Perth Metro in the future. Taking that as stretching from somewhere North of Joondalup to Mandurah. Looking at the houses popping up like mushies all along the southern corridor it seems right. I never thought I'd see it in my lifetime but I agree with him100%

Cockburn Stadium. Got a great ring to it, you gotta admit.

[niggle]

Yep. Never liked Subi as a rugby venue. If they end up building a new stadium, the best thing about it will be re-configurable seating. So for rugby/soccer they can position the crowd up close to the sideline and for afl/cricket move the stands out again.

One thing I will say for Subi, lots of good pubs nearby. Not sure what the situation is with Cockburn, Wellington Sq, Burswood or wherever else they are thinking about.

[Mambo No. 5]

Doesn't really matter..... They will spend 6 months talking about it. 12 months with a committee looking at it. 18 months in cabinet talking about it more. By then everyone has forgotten about it and all will stay as it is......

Sorry, Cynical I know.

[Redbull]

Guys the story so far (including bits you probably already know)

- ME was mooted as the rectangle stadium suitable for rugby, soccer and league. this was based on the average glory crowd and an anticpated 6-7K rugby membership. It was to be developed in 3 stages and the state government signed off on it as part of the bid to get S14 to Perth.

- As we know membership for the force exceeded the wildest expectations. ME was then too small (at stage 3) before it even got beyond the drawing board and soccer was playing silly buggas as old Nick Tana had the lease.

- Had to go to Subi (only ground capable as the WACAs a hole). Run by the WAFL and they squirmed but they wanted the cash from the state to pay for the last upgrade and so they relented (deal was for 1 season). WAFL clubs happy (they get extra cash from the deal) but the AFL not happy as they need to rearrange their schedule (limit of night games/events due to Subi council).

- Langalaut Report is looking at the venues for WA as a state. Early things identified are, that it has to be multifunctional not dedicated to one sport (such as running track around the outside with portable seats that can move closer to the field), close to the centre of Perth (getting people in and out plus the facilities before and after the game, pubs, restaurants etc) and not run by a sporting body ala WACA, Subi Oval, ME

- Rugby is going to have to go back to Subi next year. The AFL want to screw the Western Force 3-4 times the current rent due to the success of the Force. They can't get to greedy though as they want another $60 mill for another upgrade and the state is not happy with the way Andrew and co do business.

- Don't hold your breath for any quick decisions though gents

[The EnForcer]

Cheers Redbull....is Burgs suggestion of using Claremont Oval part of the current stadium review/study? It seems like a pretty good location to me, got all of the infrastructure etc.

[Burgs]

Claremont has been raised a few times in the studies but, as with Cockburn, it doesn't meet their requirement of being close to the CBD.
I think this is stupid as really, the CBD has nothing to do with sport and few people really live there either.
Especially with the new train line coming in they will be able to have dedicated express trains arriving at Showgrounds (or Cockburn or Subiaco for that matter) from Joondalup, Midland, Armidale, Mandurah and Fremantle without having the need to change at the City Central.
That is the biggest flaw with the WACA for cricket, the distance from the railway for bulk movement of spectators to and from the area to avoid agro and over crowding in lines and pubs.
I appreciate the research shasta (even if I don't appreciate Grizzelguts, he was on ABC Regional for too long!!!) the point I was making is that (unless they relocate) the concentration of the Premier Comp Rugby Clubs was down there, ie Soaks, Cott, Neddies, Uni, Wests and even Perth Bayswater really, with the rest evenly spread in a semi circle around that core, Wanneroo, Kalamunda, Palmyra & Rockingham. Wanneroo and Rockingham are going to be a long way and have to travel regardless, Palmyra is tucked in away from public transport regardless and the Cockburn option will cut Kalamunda off from the direct flow of the train network.
Even if the "centre of Greater Perth Metro" is to be around the Cockburn area, the physical and rugby centre of Perth will always or at least in the foreseeable future, remain around those core western suburbs clubs.
Unless there are two stadiums (and that's not going to happen) to build at Cockburn disregards the almost as rapid and huge growth happening in the north in places like Joondalup and throws out the centralised balance to the whole area, not just the growth boom. It also disrupts the flow of those coming in from the East beyond Midland in the foothills etc.
People aren't going to stop living in traditional areas and then you have the two growth expansions to the North and South. To me it makes the most sense to find the best location in the centre that has the best access to all parts.