Pressure on ASIC to investigate Rugby Australia’s Melbourne Rebels dealings

Perfectly expresses my feelings. Please, please, RugbyWA express this to Ms Castle. Her "wipe the slate clean" comment showed she is either naïve, ignorant or just doesn't truly understand what has happened. The REA has obviously told her a good yarn about what happened.

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Originally Posted by Hansie

It would be Naïve for Ms Castle to believe that We will ever be able to Forgive or Forget. Naturally we don't have any axe to grind with her, the Slate can never be wiped clean. For the next 100 generations 2017 will always remain as the darkest period in Australian Rugby, where the word UNION was ignored, where the custodians of the game trashed the ethos, the centuries old worldwide tradition of respect, transparency, collaboration and trust. Where the managing organisation showed total lack of leadership.

Ms Castle, we don't hold you responsible, but your organisation we do. You must as your first act to move forward is to hold a reconciliation meeting. You and your board need to hear from us how the decisions and actions of 2017 destroyed aspirations, trust and support. It's not for your board or organisation to tell us to get over it, it's not for you to tell us to suck it up and move on. Our feelings are controlled by us. Just as you can never make us feel happy or sad. Your board needs to sit up and listen to what their actions led to. Similarly I imagine most other unions have similar points to make. Yup, let's have a truth and reconciliation session, let us feel that your board hears us, until that time they do not have our respect.

The ARU board and Bill Pulver will go down in history as the board that betrayed their own, destroyed their children, acted outside the ethos of our code. Long after we are all watching or playing the game in heaven, this dark period and those involved will be remembered for all of the wrong reasons.

Well may your board say they cut us adrift for the greater good of the game. The process was unconscionable and may even be proven to have been illegal, you never engaged with us, the Force team playing under the Rebels banner may beat a kiwi team in 2018, they may even top the Australian Conference, but they will not win the competition.

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Originally Posted by SPaRTAN

One gets the feeling that Rugby WA don't really want to entertain the idea of going there own way, they seem to be holding on for dear life to the idea RugbyAustralia will one day be inclusive on Western Australia despite the fact they have spent almost a decade and a half putting roadblocks in front of our state. There seems to be a very real mentality here than even if we are bullied by our superiours whether it be in sport or politics we will stay regardless despite things getting worse and our state continuously getting taken advantage of. When you look to other parts of the world, eg. Parts of Europe/ America they tend to have a get stuffed we will do it ourselves kinda attitude, whether it be creating their own nations/ Brexit/ or Marijuana legislation, whilst we in WA just tow the party line even if it makes everything worse.

Strong leaders are strong.
Gullible leaders are gullible.

I guess as a rugby state we are at the crossroads and whatever way our leaders chose to go I sincerely hope they take the right path for everyone's sake, especially all our children/ Volunteer that have given everything to the sport and haven't received much back in return.

I tend to agree with the public sentiment in just packing our bags and going our own way, worst case we get the IPRC by leaving, however worst case by staying with the RA is the end of the spirit and no pro rugby for our state :(

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Allow me to be absolutely frank on this subject. Many hours have been spent looking at options. Secession being one, amalgamation with another Union e.g. Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia being number 2 and finally remaining with RA.

To go it alone - a la Wales, Scotland etc requires endorsement from World Rugby and feedback suggest that is highly unlikely as RA has quite some influence on member Unions. We would therefore need to invest countless hours and money to lobby the Northern Unions and others to allow us to become a new stand alone member Union. We need this sanction if we are to play the game with or against other Unions.

Merging with another Union would also require endorsement from World Rugby - the question is then what can we gain from such a merger? Whose identity for the rep team do we take?, where are we based and who has majority board or shares (influence).

We are Australian and our kids want to play for the Wallabies. That is the overwhelming feedback. People still go on and on about us sending money to RA - LET ME SAY, that is not the case. A player's subs paid to a community club is made up of the Insurance component - which RA has blanket cover with Gow Gates and the portion of subs goes through Rugby Link to the Insurer. The second portion which covers RugbyWA competition management comes right back to RugbyWA and the balance goes right back to the club. If you want to show RA the bird - then let their sponsors know, do not go to test matches, unsubscribe from Foxtel and do not buy merchandise.

Just because of a handful of myopic, vengeful, and narrow minded people leading an Organisation where the vast majority are incredibly dedicated people, we should react by seceding is not sensible. Pulver is gone, Castle will hear from us, Clyne will go, as will a few others on the board.

We will actually come out of this a lot stronger than those cretins expected. Our high performance academy will still be the best in the country, our Western Force is back in our hands and we can play NRC and also international matches. Andrew and his team have been absolutely fantastic in supporting us. IPRC will play in 2019 and my feeling is that we shall make it such a success that in 2021 we get to choose who from the other States and Countries should join "our competition". Be sad to limit Australian teams in our comp in 2021 to perhaps the Reds and Brumbies, plus the Western Force - wouldn't it!!!! Look..that last sentence from me is a bit vengeful isn't it and unlikely to happen.....

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Originally Posted by Hansie

Be sad to limit Australian teams in our comp in 2021 to perhaps the Reds and Brumbies, plus the Western Force - wouldn't it!!!! Look..that last sentence from me is a bit vengeful isn't it and unlikely to happen.....

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Jeez I'm glad you think that's unlikely, there's no way in hell the Reds deserve to be there.

If I was very vindictive which I can be maybe a team to a new team out of South Aus and no spot for victorians.

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Originally Posted by mothy

If I was very vindictive which I can be maybe a team to a new team out of South Aus and no spot for victorians.

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Ox already has an academy set up in Adelaide and is breeding the talent as we speak :approve:

And we should get the Islanders involved too, so a team from Tassie as well :sarcastic:

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Originally Posted by mothy

If I was very vindictive which I can be maybe a team to a new team out of South Aus and no spot for victorians.

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The Croweaters hate the RA too. Lost the 7s and haven't hosted an international since 2006.

Back on the topic of ASIC, this media release about a CEO being prosecuted for providing false and misleading info to the company's board of directors is very interesting......

http://asic.gov.au/about-asic/media-...g-information/


"18-016MR Former Australian Bight Abalone CEO convicted over false and misleading information

Mr Andrew Ferguson, the former Chief Executive Officer of abalone farmer, Australian Bight Abalone (ABA), was today found guilty on 17 counts related to providing false or misleading information to the ABA Board of Directors and prospective investors following a jury trial in the District Court of South Australia.

Following an ASIC investigation, Mr Ferguson was charged with nine counts of disseminating false or misleading information to prospective investors, via grower reports, product disclosure statements and a media release issued by ABA during 2007 and 2008. The jury found that these documents contained false or misleading information about survival rates of the abalone and harvest prospects.

The remaining eight counts were related to providing false or misleading information to the directors of ABA, in reports submitted to the Board about operations at the ABA farm.

During the trial, the jury heard from a number of witnesses involved in the farming operation including marine biologists, operational staff, divers and former directors.

Acting ASIC Chair Peter Kell said, "Company officers are in a position of critical responsibility and trust, and it is expected that their behaviour is beyond reproach. This verdict sends an important signal that misleading investors will not be tolerated."

The matter has been listed for sentencing submissions before the District Court of South Australia on 18 April 2018.

Mr Ferguson's bail was today revoked and he has been remanded in custody. Mr Ferguson faces a maximum of five years' imprisonment and/or a fine of $22,000 for each count.

The matter is being prosecuted by the Commonwealth Director of Public Prosecutions.

Background

ABA was Australia's largest off-shore abalone farmer, raising about $44 million from 1400 investors over four years. ABA operated an abalone farm in off-shore cages located near Elliston in South Australia between 2005 and 2009. The company also operated managed investment schemes (MIS), through which investors acquired interests in abalone grown at the farm, entitling them to returns from the sale of harvested abalone.

The initial MIS project was offered to wholesale investors only in 2005, but a MIS was offered to retail investors in each subsequent year between 2006 and 2009.

Administrators (McGrath Nicol) were appointed to ABA in July 2009 after the company had been able to undertake only a limited harvest of the abalone stock. The Administrators reported that a survey conducted of the abalone stock at the farm suggested significantly higher mortality than had been expected.

Mr Ferguson pleaded not guilty to the charges against him."

Nice work Alison

Well that's interesting. The Rat's Arse game plan always seemed to be a simple one: cut the Force and throw Pulver under the bus when it's done. Simple. Unless of course, there is a prosecution. All the skeletons would then come stampeding out of the closet. They didn't see that one coming, I reckon. Here's hoping.

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Originally Posted by shasta

Well that's interesting. The Rat's Arse game plan always seemed to be a simple one: cut the Force and throw Pulver under the bus when it's done. Simple. Unless of course, there is a prosecution. All the skeletons would then come stampeding out of the closet. They didn't see that one coming, I reckon. Here's hoping.

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De Clyne signing off on August 18 minutes in December that year after the Alliance Agreement and cull was agreed takes the biscuit.

In addition to sabotaging the Own The Force scheme preventing investors buying in - surely that would carry some weight in terms of interfering with trade.

Reynolds should have nailed that angle but unfortunately she was limited to time. They could have scheduled another hearing and called in Cox, Gray and Hawkins. Those three were up for the picking.

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Originally Posted by Hansie

Allow me to be absolutely frank on this subject. Many hours have been spent looking at options. Secession being one, amalgamation with another Union e.g. Hong Kong, Singapore, Malaysia being number 2 and finally remaining with RA.

To go it alone - a la Wales, Scotland etc requires endorsement from World Rugby and feedback suggest that is highly unlikely as RA has quite some influence on member Unions. We would therefore need to invest countless hours and money to lobby the Northern Unions and others to allow us to become a new stand alone member Union. We need this sanction if we are to play the game with or against other Unions.

Merging with another Union would also require endorsement from World Rugby - the question is then what can we gain from such a merger? Whose identity for the rep team do we take?, where are we based and who has majority board or shares (influence).

We are Australian and our kids want to play for the Wallabies. That is the overwhelming feedback. People still go on and on about us sending money to RA - LET ME SAY, that is not the case. A player's subs paid to a community club is made up of the Insurance component - which RA has blanket cover with Gow Gates and the portion of subs goes through Rugby Link to the Insurer. The second portion which covers RugbyWA competition management comes right back to RugbyWA and the balance goes right back to the club. If you want to show RA the bird - then let their sponsors know, do not go to test matches, unsubscribe from Foxtel and do not buy merchandise.

Just because of a handful of myopic, vengeful, and narrow minded people leading an Organisation where the vast majority are incredibly dedicated people, we should react by seceding is not sensible. Pulver is gone, Castle will hear from us, Clyne will go, as will a few others on the board.

We will actually come out of this a lot stronger than those cretins expected. Our high performance academy will still be the best in the country, our Western Force is back in our hands and we can play NRC and also international matches. Andrew and his team have been absolutely fantastic in supporting us. IPRC will play in 2019 and my feeling is that we shall make it such a success that in 2021 we get to choose who from the other States and Countries should join "our competition". Be sad to limit Australian teams in our comp in 2021 to perhaps the Reds and Brumbies, plus the Western Force - wouldn't it!!!! Look..that last sentence from me is a bit vengeful isn't it and unlikely to happen.....

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Now allow me to be absolutely Fulvio on this subject.

We appear to be playing the ARU's game; leave it for 6 mths for the dust to settle and the west aussies will fall back into being a sub-servient, do as you're told, out of sight - out of mind bunch of red-necks miles from HQ who we will pay lip-service to when we want something from them.

We are "West Australian" and our kids don't necessarily want to play for the ARU's team (can't even say the word anymore); our kids should aspire to playing for WA and tour the region and if good enough play pro or amateur rugby in any of 200 countries in the world, taking good advantage of the internationality of the game; just as your son did Hansie.

Hansie, the ARU still have full transparency on WA registrations so they have control. Anyone who's received an email a week from the ARU as a former Force member or clubby realises that we are in "their system" and we shouldn't be. We should dictate when and how we communicate with that mob and what we decide to participate in.

West Australians are to Australia what the Catalans are to Spain. Never forgive, never forget.

Right now and it seems our lot in life going forward is that WA will be beholding to that mob for everything; even if a wa club or school wants to tour interstate or overseas we have to ask their permission.

Bollocks I say, take whatever scraps they think we are worthy of and plot to piss them off; we need to take charge of our own destiny.

The IPRC should have been set up out of Singapore. The way it is now the ARU will have enough control to control by remote the IPRC's future. A real pity that when the IPRC broadcast deal is being established, the ARU will be at the negotiation table; and they shouldn't be even in the building.

We have an ideal opportunity now to plan our future; putting our independence On Hold is not an option otherwise it will be back to the future for us.

Seize the moment Hansie.



PS Apologies to Fulvio

PPS I have recently cancelled my plans for the RWC in Japan as I don't have a team participating any more. Instead I'm building up my enthusiasm and dollars for some trips to exotic parts of Asia to support the Force in the IPRC; rugby the way it should be and it will be fun. The last few years paying for test matches for the ARU's team was done out of a misguided sense of loyalty; never again.

Well said. If the other unions apart from the Rebels had the option that the Force has they would have done it years ago.

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Originally Posted by Darkness

Now allow me to be absolutely Fulvio on this subject.

We appear to be playing the ARU's game; leave it for 6 mths for the dust to settle and the west aussies will fall back into being a sub-servient, do as you're told, out of sight - out of mind bunch of red-necks miles from HQ who we will pay lip-service to when we want something from them.

We are "West Australian" and our kids don't necessarily want to play for the ARU's team (can't even say the word anymore); our kids should aspire to playing for WA and tour the region and if good enough play pro or amateur rugby in any of 200 countries in the world, taking good advantage of the internationality of the game; just as your son did Hansie.

Hansie, the ARU still have full transparency on WA registrations so they have control. Anyone who's received an email a week from the ARU as a former Force member or clubby realises that we are in "their system" and we shouldn't be. We should dictate when and how we communicate with that mob and what we decide to participate in.

West Australians are to Australia what the Catalans are to Spain. Never forgive, never forget.

Right now and it seems our lot in life going forward is that WA will be beholding to that mob for everything; even if a wa club or school wants to tour interstate or overseas we have to ask their permission.

Bollocks I say, take whatever scraps they think we are worthy of and plot to piss them off; we need to take charge of our own destiny.

The IPRC should have been set up out of Singapore. The way it is now the ARU will have enough control to control by remote the IPRC's future. A real pity that when the IPRC broadcast deal is being established, the ARU will be at the negotiation table; and they shouldn't be even in the building.

We have an ideal opportunity now to plan our future; putting our independence On Hold is not an option otherwise it will be back to the future for us.

Seize the moment Hansie.



PS Apologies to Fulvio

PPS I have recently cancelled my plans for the RWC in Japan as I don't have a team participating any more. Instead I'm building up my enthusiasm and dollars for some trips to exotic parts of Asia to support the Force in the IPRC; rugby the way it should be and it will be fun. The last few years paying for test matches for the ARU's team was done out of a misguided sense of loyalty; never again.

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Brilliant post. Bang on the money. Alot of us dont care for the ARU or the Wallabies anymore, its only our leaders that seem to back that sentiment. Most of us want to move on, just look at the results of the poll on the side bar, its obvious we are done with the ARU, well all of us except RugbyWA!