ARU $3.5m offer to keep Lote

[Maurice Cowan]

Lote has been overrated and overpaid for years, he would struggle to make an all black B team, the trouble with some wallabies is that they don't play with enough pride for the wallaby jumper,and pride is something you cant by. just ask any AB player who is playing for far less than they would receive overseas,its the black jumper that keeps them in nz.
Now Gits is worth every cent,he is a standout so far.

[frontrow]

Well said maurice, spot on in my book...

[Nick]

So for $875k a year he's too much? Fair enough, but to compare the Australian and NZ player market is a little like apples and oranges, the depth of NZ rugby is a little different so the whole supply and demand issues for players is skewed.

Your also pulling one overyourselves if you think NZ doesn't have issues with player retention...

Piri Weepu is looking at a potential leauge move, Aron Mauger is looking to the Northern Hemisphere, Justin Marshall, Carlos Spencer, already gone Flavell spent a fair bit of time in Japan - Tipoki seriously considered leaving NZ when suspended there is a hell of a lot more and after the World Cup dont be surprised if the dollar doesn't talk for a lot of those currently in a AB's jersey (like say Thorne - Hayman - Oliver).

Player retention is a huge issue every where.

Then of course you have PR a lot of fans would rather cough up Pay TV subscription for big names than to see an unproven rookie - to spend money on grass roots you have to generate it as well.

[frontrow]

Nice balanced comeback nick, your posts are quite level headed and well informed..Keep 'em coming...

[Nick]

Cheers mate - I wish I was as level headed when I watch the game but I have to admit my fair share of spleen venting! Thankfully it's usually at the TV - besides my Aussie Rugby mates usually dont let me away with too much.

[Sagerian]

Lote has been overrated and overpaid for years, he would struggle to make an all black B team, the trouble with some wallabies is that they don't play with enough pride for the wallaby jumper,and pride is something you cant by. just ask any AB player who is playing for far less than they would receive overseas,its the black jumper that keeps them in nz.
Now Gits is worth every cent,he is a standout so far.

I still don't think Gits is worth that much money. If he is, than the market value for others has to come up and it'll cost more to retain players, Lote included in that.

Great post!

So for $875k a year he's too much? Fair enough, but to compare the Australian and NZ player market is a little like apples and oranges, the depth of NZ rugby is a little different so the whole supply and demand issues for players is skewed.

Your also pulling one overyourselves if you think NZ doesn't have issues with player retention...

Piri Weepu is looking at a potential leauge move, Aron Mauger is looking to the Northern Hemisphere, Justin Marshall, Carlos Spencer, already gone Flavell spent a fair bit of time in Japan - Tipoki seriously considered leaving NZ when suspended there is a hell of a lot more and after the World Cup dont be surprised if the dollar doesn't talk for a lot of those currently in a AB's jersey (like say Thorne - Hayman - Oliver).

Player retention is a huge issue every where.

Then of course you have PR a lot of fans would rather cough up Pay TV subscription for big names than to see an unproven rookie - to spend money on grass roots you have to generate it as well.

Better post!

Absolutely agreed.

[Happy]

Well said Shaun. Dont wont to play for your country..bugger off.

bit harsh - he wants to play for Australia for the world cup but wants to return to league after that. So I don't think saying he doesn't want to play for his country is a fair call.

It obviously IS NOT a monetary thing (going back to league) so maybe he just has personal reasons for it which we are not privvy too.

[Nick]

I think a lot of players will be revaluating thier playing future post World Cup and side from the points I mentioned before is it really that bad that he and his agent are looking for more money?

A professional Rugby Player has limited life span, will Lote go on to Coach post his playing days? Or will he be calling the games? I really cant see that happening, retirement and the rise of a new star will end endorsements and then what...

He was a Star in League and a Star in Union for Australia, he is chasing a world cup dream this year and after that maybe he thinks he's met his union goals and it's time to either return to the game he loves or get paid while the body holds out. It's not as if he's looking to play in england, change nationality and collect a pay cheque...

[AndyS]

Tough one, not helped by the typical media sensationalising of the deal. Depends what we are talking about - is it a guaranteed number or what he might earn in total with a following wind (ARU + S14, contract + all possible match payments)? Is it just the ARU component? If it is the total possible, it probably isn't far outside the existing envelope. But if it is either guaranteed or just the ARU component, I'd say it is well over the existing odds. My memory from the general uproar over Giteau's deal was that the money he actually got from rugby was ~$750k between both the ARU & Force.

My personal feeling is that, if the EOS tour showed anything, it was that Tuqiri is a specialist wing. As such, I just don't think he is worth the money regardless. He is a very good player when his head is in the game, but that just doesn't seem to be the case a lot of the time. I also think he has lost a yard of pace.

As investments go, I think they would be better off looking at Hewitt, Shepherd, Mitchell and a number of younger players with speed. If they are worried about experience, they still have Gerrard, Rathbone and even Staniforth available. To my mind, the sort of money they are talking about is for players that are irreplaceable - I just don't think Tuqiri falls into that category any more.

[Burgs]

Gee I wish you hadn't put the name Hewitt in that post Andy
Was reading really good till then
The trouble with such big payments (and this includes Gits) if a season ending injury occurs then that is a massive investment to have sitting idle! Not sure of Lote's injury profile but as Palavi found out just this week, retirement is just an injury away.
As a background ball park figure, I was told that a particular non Wallaby Prop who was probably 60/40 odds to start for his S14 team each week was on "a bit over $100k".
No way of verifying that but the source would know.
I guess then you look at it and say is Lote worth 8-9 times that Prop?
That's a big call for an individual player to be worth 8-9 times another, especially a Winger.
Is Lote say 10 times better than Brett Stapleton? He is definitely better, but 10 times better???

[Nick]

I guess then you look at it and say is Lote worth 8-9 times that Prop?
That's a big call for an individual player to be worth 8-9 times another, especially a Winger.
Is Lote say 10 times better than Brett Stapleton? He is definitely better, but 10 times better???

Im not a big Lote fan but lets be honest a prop is the engine room and as far as players and true red blooded rugby fans go just as important.

Having said that who do the sponsors want representing them, who do the fans want autographs from, who puts bums on seats? This is professional Rugby it's never just about the game. Apparently one of the reasons why there are a shortage of front row talent in Aust is because kids dont dream of being a prop they dream of being a Gits, a Mortlock or Tiquri. You can be sure a lot of Mums and Dad's out there dont want there son packing in the front row. The recent neck injury's will amplify that.

[Happy]

The trouble with such big payments (and this includes Gits) if a season ending injury occurs then that is a massive investment to have sitting idle!

providing of course there are no clauses in the contract for injuries - which we wouldn't know !

[Burgs]

Spot on Nick and it is quite an Australian thing, in SA Props are as big, if not bigger stars as the pretty boys!
A beef industry sponsorship deal screeming out to be had!!!

For sure Happy, but you have to agree, clause or not, you won't be seeing them down the dole office every Thursday if they get injured?
There would be performance related factors but there would be far greater than National average wage payments even if they are injured for the year.

[travelling_gerry]

Your a stakeholder Burgs....put it up at AGM

[littleleck]

Do we have any idea yet as to how much of the offer is coming out of the ARU's pocket
and how much of it is actually just from 3rd party?
Brett Stapleton is probably better than Lote in my biased opinion and i'm sure there are plenty
of people who agree with me, so it is absolute madness to be offering Lote so much money.
Methinks that Lote is turning 28 this year, so the future is limited compared to somone like
Brett for example.
Boo Hiss ARU