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Thread: The Western Force IP and brand,, Time to leave it behind and move forward..

  1. #31
    Champion Bakkies's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kiap View Post
    RA put a bullet in the history.

    It seems the most they're gonna allow is for the "Western Force" name to be on loan (e.g. for the NRC).

    They're not going to just give it back as a token of good will, like it or not.

    Hell, the RA would take away the IP of the remaining Supe teams as well if they could. Even that of the Tahs, who had to downsize their admin recently to stay free from the clutches of Brett Robinson's cronies.

    If the name is only going to be used on loan for the NRC (as run by RA), well, it might be okay to go along with that shit sandwich.

    The history at least survives in a token form.

    Comparatively little should be invested from WA into the NRC. Just keep using it as a development comp while it lasts.

    Not one red cent should be spent rebuilding the brand owned by RA, IMO.

    The focus should be on the new Perth pro team they don't have claws in. If that name is the Perth Force, then all good.

    I don't have an issue with it being used in the NRC as long as entry is virtually free and merchandise isn't readily available so the RA don't profit from it.

    To address another comment raised about the RA claiming the IP for the other sides. Well they had the IP of the Rebels when the VRU handed it over as they couldn't manage the side financially and structurally.

    Largely based upon the bs put forward by Anthony French where he said the Brumbies were close to being insolvent which wasn't the case and was proven later on to the morons the RA had proposed a strategic alliance with the team. No mention of the IP being taken off the Brumbies which the Brumbies clubs would have voted against as they have known for over 20 odd years not to trust an organisation run in and for Sydney.

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  2. #32
    Immortal Contributor shasta's Avatar
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    Many sporting teams go through partial name changes. The Brooklyn Dodgers are still the (LA) Dodgers. South Melbourne are still The Swans. Footscray are still Bulldogs but the Canterbury "Berries" are now Bulldogs and The Mighty Ducks are now just ordinary old Ducks.
    I'm attached to "Force" after initially thinking it was lame and definitely want it retained. But Perth Force, WA Force or similar is no biggie for me. Ditto Spirit.

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  3. #33
    Senior Player SPaRTAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moono74 View Post
    I agree with most of the comments above. There is no point establishing a history, ethos, an identity and most importantly shared memories, all under the guise of the Western Force to then throw that out and re-brand with an entirely new name etc. Some tinkering around the edges is fine, but the roots now firmly established should not be ripped from the ground.

    Great sporting clubs and their importance to the communities in which they are embedded, are built on tradition and the bonds established through sharing the highs and lows on and off the field, the victories and the defeats.

    We are known as The Force, we play in Blue and Black and we carry the black swan logo over our hearts.
    Why can't we just register the name "The Force" and move on? Is it only the "Western Force" that RA own the IP for? Surely The Force cover everything, everyone just uses the Force moniker anyway

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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by SPaRTAN View Post
    Why can't we just register the name "The Force" and move on? Is it only the "Western Force" that RA own the IP for? Surely The Force cover everything, everyone just uses the Force moniker anyway
    Depending on the nature of the new competition and if the Force were part of a revised Super Rugby in 2020 or the IPRC it is often advantageous to have a geographical association with the name of the franchise/team to help fans know who's who.

    Not sure if the IP rights extend to more than just the name and cover the logo and playing colours as well?

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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moono74 View Post
    Not sure if the IP rights extend to more than just the name and cover the logo and playing colours as well?
    They can cover the logo if it is a unique enough artwork to be distinct, AFAIK (basic shapes and/or letters ... not so much).

    Colours are not so easy. While I won't say totally impossible to protect colours (e.g. Cadbury's purple), I think it's tightly limited in scope and difficult to obtain.

    How much do folks want to pay the lawyers?

    Hard to see the law being used to stop a sports team wearing "black" or "blue" or "yellow".

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  6. #36
    Immortal GIGS20's Avatar
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    Colours can be trademarked, however proving that a colour used by another party is actually the same colour can be tricky, so many companies just don't bother (there are 16.7 million colours in a 24 bit olour palette)

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    C'mon the

  7. #37
    Champion chibi's Avatar
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    The name and colours were taken from a couple of American teams already, so I think it will be a hard task for RA to say we can't use them.





    "Western Force" may be copyright, but I can't see how "WA Force" "Perth Force" "Western Spirit" or any other combination could be blocked by RA, unless those combinations are included in the copyright. Colours are a public domain idea, so you can't stop a team wearing mid-blue...

    ...or gold'n'black...

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    Japan and the Pacific Islands for Aussie Super 9's!

    Let's have one of these in WA! Click this link: Saitama Super Arena - New Perth Stadium?

  8. #38
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    I seem to remember a Kiwi netball team with the name Western Force that had to be paid off in our first year.

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  9. #39
    Immortal GIGS20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chibi View Post
    Colours are a public domain idea, so you can't stop a team wearing mid-blue... ...or gold'n'black...
    No, but you can trademark ocean blue, you need to identify it stringently. It would be so stringent that the change in blue from 2006 to 2017 would be outside the range, making it pretty worthless in the long run. I suspect this wasn't done and if it was, there'll be several shades that have already been used on force jerseys that wouldnt be protected. Not to mention the mountain of options that would be close enough for the average punter not to notice the difference

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  10. #40
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    Almost right. Here it is. I think it cost our Force a few dollars to stop the crap fight over the name.

    Super 14 rugby team, the Western Force, says it did not take all the proper patent precautions in New Zealand when registering its name.
    "We registered the name and took all the proper patent precautions in Australia, but we didn't search New Zealand to the same extent," said the company's Perth chief executive Peter O'Meara.
    The new Perth outfit, which launched its name and black swan logo in a blaze of publicity on April 19 ahead of next year's competition, is working with the Australian Rugby Union (ARU) to try to resolve what has the potential to become a costly dispute with National Bank Cup netball side the Force, The Australian newspaper reports.

    More here

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/rugby/news...ectid=10328529

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  11. #41
    Champion Bakkies's Avatar
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    Type Western Force in to the IP Australia website trademark search and it will tell you what is covered.

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  12. #42
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    My 20 cent's worth.....

    I reckon:

    1. The Western Force will be the professional team which plays in Mindaroo's invitation games in 2018.

    2. The Perth Spirit will play in the NRC as it is a mix of pro and amateur and it has history. (I'm happy to ignore what's been said by whoever as it makes no sense to change the winning name!!)

    3. The team which plays in the IPRC will have a name which fits in with the 5 other teams. It is likely to be Perth ???? as they will want it to be clearly identified with location.

    Note: Force does not have good connotations in Asia as it's associated with the strong-arm tactics of military regimes and other forms of bad government.

    Get over the name thing. Leave it to outfit that's paying the bills!

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    Last edited by andrewg; 26-02-18 at 19:32.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrewg View Post
    My 20 cent's worth.....

    I reckon:

    1. The Western Force will be the professional team which plays in Mindaroo's invitation games in 2018.

    2. The Perth Spirit will play in the NRC as it is a mix of pro and amateur and it has history. (I'm happy to ignore what's been said by whoever as it makes no sense to change the winning name!!)

    3. The team which plays in the IPRC will have a name which fits in with the 5 other teams. It is likely to be Perth ???? as they will want it to be clearly identified with location.

    Note: Force does not have good connotations in Asia as it's associated with the strong-arm tactics of military regimes and other forms of bad government.

    Get over the name thing. Leave it to outfit that's paying the bills!
    Mineroo registered the names Perth Force and RugbyRoos a few weeks ago. Western Force and Perth Spirit are still registered to the ARU.

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  14. #44
    Champion Bakkies's Avatar
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    other forms of bad government.
    Like certain Rugby organisations based in Sydney?

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  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by JSJ View Post
    Mineroo registered the names Perth Force and RugbyRoos a few weeks ago. Western Force and Perth Spirit are still registered to the ARU.
    Yeah although "Perth Force" was submitted back in September from memory so it's taken a while.

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