Senate hearing - Wednesday

[lou]

good point

[Alison]

Now I'm probably giving too much attention to a minor issue here but this did prick my ears when Bill said this back in September. I thought it very odd at the time that he'd stress the confidentiality of the ARU's financial relationship with the Rebels and refused to give any figures, yet he was quite happy to state specific figures (real or not) in relation to the Force. Only latter in the inquiry he hid behind confidentiality with the WARU and WA Gov in an act of what-aboutism, while the Senators stated that the WA parties have no problem revealing the information.
So to me it seemed as he'd avoid saying anything about the Rebels but was more than happy to blurt out about the Force on the very same issues, so much for his high ethical regard for confidentiality.

Absolutely spot on.

[Bakkies]

When will we find out if the Senate is going to take action against Pulver, de Clyne and Clarke?

[Bakkies]

It's only confidential when it suits him.

Senator REYNOLDS: Yes. By investing in community rugby, how much money are you directly going to make this financial year? Obviously you've thought about the way you want to spend the money, so can you tell us exactly how much—not necessarily to the dollar—the projected savings are, how they're going to be distributed and when the funding will start? It has been put to the committee separately that the funding will be used to pay off ARU debt and will not actually go into community rugby this financial year or next financial year.

Mr Pulver : We have no debt. We have zero debt, so I don't know where the debt issue comes from.

This is the same fellow that said that the RA was facing insolvency, the organisation has run losses and they were handing out millions like chump change to the Rebels that was never going to be paid back. How can you say have no debt...

Senator REYNOLDS: Yes. By investing in community rugby, how much money are you directly going to make this financial year? Obviously you've thought about the way you want to spend the money, so can you tell us exactly how much—not necessarily to the dollar—the projected savings are, how they're going to be distributed and when the funding will start? It has been put to the committee separately that the funding will be used to pay off ARU debt and will not actually go into community rugby this financial year or next financial year.

Mr Pulver : We have no debt. We have zero debt, so I don't know where the debt issue comes from.

Senator REYNOLDS: You can give an absolute assurance? Perhaps you could take it on notice if you don't know the figure now. How much are you expected to save? How will it hit community rugby?

Mr Pulver : Excuse me, I'm giving you the exact figure. It was in my prepared notes. It is roughly the $6 million per annum of funding that goes to the Western Force, which is $18 million over the period. What we need to do is have more effective investment in the community game and more effective investment in high-performance outcomes as well. If I can answer your question—

That's a lie. He could have answered it was going to the Rebels and Reds as that would be more truthful.

Senator REYNOLDS: Mr Pulver, with the greatest of respect, all senators here understand how a board and an organisation works and has to live within its means. We understand that. But it was a very specific question. The $6 million savings from Western Force—you had indicated and publicly in your statement here that that will go into community rugby to start addressing some of the issues you have identified. But you also said just then, as I understand it, that that money will mostly go into other Super Rugby club teams to compensate them for financial deficits they’ve got.

Mr Pulver : Senator, as I said in my prepared remarks, that money, where possible, will be reinvested in things like community rugby, in delivering better high-performance outcomes and in women's rugby.

Senator REYNOLDS: So, while you've indicated that it might go and support the community rugby, it is also going to be split—it is not going to go very far. Some of it may go to community rugby and some of it is going to prop up other Super Rugby teams

Mr Pulver : This time of year, basically between now and December, we will sit down with every state union and work through their funding agreements for next year.

Senator REYNOLDS: Okay. That is the remaining four teams—

Mr Pulver : These are not decisions we just make unilaterally at the ARU level. This is a consultative process we have with the states.

Senator REYNOLDS: Yes. So the first call on this $6 million then will be the remaining four Super Rugby teams and, if there's anything left after those consultations, it will go to community rugby?

Mr Pulver : No. That is not right. We have fixed funding agreements with the state unions for their Super Rugby teams and at this point in time we do not plan to change those.

Senator REYNOLDS: How then are you going to put more money into community rugby if it is not going to go into the—

Mr Pulver : That is exactly how we would put more money into community rugby. And one very good example is that we have launched this year a women's national seven series, and I am hoping—

Correct Senator Reynolds he knows where it is going and sweet fa will go to community Rugby.

Senator REYNOLDS: Which, I understand, Mr Forrest offered to very handsomely support.

Mr Pulver : No, he didn't have any view on the women's seven series.

Did you bother to ask him or did you get your mate Cameron to ask him?

Senator REYNOLDS: RugbyWA officials in this room—so I'm certain that they would be happy for you to do that, even today, if somebody you've got here could check with Victorian Rugby. This comes down to the heart of the issue. ARU have been talking about a great big spreadsheet and all of this analysis but I don't think anybody has actually seen it, so you're at a significant advantage over everybody else because we haven't see it.

Mr Pulver : The owner of the Melbourne Rebels is a private entrepreneur and I'm not at liberty to release his financial data and other confidential data relating to his enterprise.

Yet his technically insolvent books are available online in NZ for the world to see and cheaper than the two sales of the Rabble to the VRU.

Finally, you mentioned in your opening statement, Mr Pulver, extensive due diligence. Could you just sort of elaborate on what that due diligence was or the elements of it?

Mr Pulver : There's been a lot of due diligence, Senator. Which particular piece are you talking about?

Senator SMITH: I'm referring to the extensive due diligence you talked about in your opening statement, which was, I think, the due diligence that went around the use of the scorecard. I'll find the exact quote.

Mr Pulver : The due diligence I referred to was in relation to the scorecard and it was also in relation to the Melbourne Rebels.

Senator SMITH: You said, 'extensive due diligence'.

Mr Pulver : If and when we can get you the full scorecard, you will see the comprehensive nature of that document. I think that will be evidence for you of the extensive due diligence we've done.

Senator SMITH: The interpretation I put on your use of the words 'extensive due diligence'—I was expecting third-party oversight.

Mr Pulver : There was third-party oversight.

C'mon on Bill you never did due diligence.

CHAIR: Before we go on, I want to go back to this decision about the Rebels versus the Western Force. Just then, you said it was a financial decision. But from what you said earlier—again, I'll go back to what I read in the documents—you were saying you couldn't have chosen the Rebels to leave because of the processes that we went through earlier. So what was the point of doing the financials if you get to the point where you can't kick them out anyway?

Mr Pulver : Actually, throughout that process, as I suggested earlier, there was a negotiation around the ownership of the Rebels. Had we purchased the Rebels' licence we could have shut the team down. That was part of the financial due diligence we did. That was one example. The other example was that in the event of insolvency the licence would have come back to the ARU.

Yet you made sure it didn't go back to the RA even though you will be funding it.

Mr Pulver : You are correct that we did not have a unilateral right to remove the Melbourne Rebels from the competition. The only circumstances in which that could have taken place was a negotiated settlement or an insolvency event.

CHAIR: I understand that. You're saying those two got ruled out?

Mr Pulver : No. Those two were both live right up until the final decision.

CHAIR: So why did you not choose to purchase them so that you could have them be in the same situation?

Mr Pulver : The economics of that transaction just did not work out for the ARU.

A beggar off the street would give you a dollar if you weren't willing to cough up Bill.

Senator REYNOLDS: Did you not think of doing an alliance agreement like you did with Western Force? Then you would have had control or the ability to deal with either team.

Mr Pulver : Senator, we needed to save the $6 million of funding from one team and reduce by one team. An alliance agreement would not have achieved that.

You had an alliance agreement with them to donate money freely despite their 'private ownership.'

Senator REYNOLDS: But it was the enabling action.

Mr Pulver : Senator, the alliance agreement was the result of Western Force essentially being insolvent. It was the result of Australian Rugby contributing $3 ½ million to pay a net liability number to keep that team on the paddock. It occurred—

Straight out lie about being insolvent especially when you don't know the definition of insolvent, debt and loans. If the Force, etc were actually insolvent the directors would have had to put their organisations under voluntary administration as per the responsibility. A responsibility that you should be aware of as the RA CEO.

Your mate the bum Anthony French also said the Brumbies were facing insolvency which was also nonsense.

CHAIR: Sorry. We were talking about the alliance and the decision you made there in the context of choosing not to do it for the Rebels.

Mr Pulver : What we did with the Rebels was to find a private owner. Around the world of sport, private ownership is a model that has been used successfully in a lot of countries. Frankly, it was a model we wanted to assess in Australia as well. In an ideal world—in France or England, for example—there are billionaires who run their Rugby teams and they don't care how much money they lose. Their passion for the game is so overwhelming that they'll spend whatever they like. That sounds like a pretty good model for a governing body where you have people who are prepared to invest that sort of money. In fact, that is why we were quite excited about the conversation with Mr Andrew Forrest. In this case, we wanted to try a private ownership model and hence we entered the relationship with Imperium Sports Management.

Don't you mean fund the Rebels private owner? Your mate hooked him up with the deal of the century and the RA were donating money to cover debts.

Mr Pulver : The big challenge for the Brumbies is that they reside in a market called Canberra, and 50 per cent of the economics of that market is largely driven by politicians who are not as supportive of their local team as we—

Senator SMITH: Hence my question about market position.

Yet the Brumbies have had years with more season ticket holders than your second team the Tahs, Bill. Throw in higher sponsorship deals. As for the snide comment about politicians towards politicians Canberra is mostly full of politicians from your second home Bill, NSW.

For example, the Western Australian government invested $120 or $130 million. That presumably would have been on the spreadsheet.

Mr Pulver : Which $120-130 million are you talking about?

Senator REYNOLDS: The negotiations you did with state government for the NIB Stadium and the RugbyWA headquarters.

Mr Pulver : That was not front and centre in the review because, clearly, various states have invested enormous amounts of money in building stadia for multiple sports.

Senator REYNOLDS: As I understand it, the Victorian government funding—

Mr Pulver : The Victorian government therefore would take credit for AAMI Park, which is probably the second-best Rugby stadium in the country.

Didn't the WA Government say that the Force were the main reason why NIB Stadium went under redevelopment?

Senator REYNOLDS: But you did come to some arrangement with the Victorian government that they would provide some financial support. Is that correct?

Mr Pulver : I am happy to say 'yes', but the terms of those relationships are confidential. Your point is about stadia—

The Vic Gov't is propped up by tax payers Bill so they are entitled to know what is going down the bottomless pit. The Federal Government who you were talking to face to face also provide GST money towards Victoria so if GST money is going to the Rebels they are entitled to know what it was wasted on.

Senator REYNOLDS: Was the secret Victorian government funding on the scorecard?

A secret that is on a secret that you won't release to their masters.

Mr Pulver : No, you won't see the financial terms of our relationship with the Victorian government, unless they were prepared to release it, and I think that's unlikely.

Senator REYNOLDS: I'll come back to your point about transparency. We'll see what you provide and then we'll—

Mr Pulver : I spent as much time in Western Australia talking to the Western Australian government about opportunities to support the Western Force as I did in Victoria. Senator, would you be happy with me releasing the terms of the WA financial relationship in Victoria?

No it isn't Bill. Look who you sent over to Perth in April.

Senator REYNOLDS: You said 'debt', but you also said up front that you don't give loans, and there haven't been any loans that haven't been paid back.

Mr Pulver : There have been loans historically, which pre-date me. There was a loan to Queensland Rugby Union going back to, I think, around 2009.

What about the 'loans' that you dished out after Teflon John resigned?

Senator REYNOLDS: Also, according to those records, I've got here that the Rebels received loans in 2011, 2012, 2013 and 2014 of $13 million over those years and that the ARU wrote off all of those loans, when, you said, there was a private investor acquired.

Mr Pulver : Yes.

Senator REYNOLDS: On their books up to 2014—in 2015—you were saying that you thought that they were almost insolvent. Is that partially because of all the loans that they hadn't paid back owing to ARU?

Mr Pulver : That was leading up to the period when we sold the enterprise to Imperium Sports Management. That's correct.

Senator REYNOLDS: As part of that deal to Imperium Sports in 2015, they had cumulative loans outstanding to the ARU of $13 million and you wrote off that $13 million worth of loans for zero consideration when you transferred it to Imperium.

Mr Pulver : The number you're talking about make up the $28 million of unbudgeted funding in the last five years that we've talked about. Of the $28 million, the lion's share of that—correct—was in relation to the Rebels. Eight million dollars of that since 2015 has been in relation to the Force.

What about the money you wasted on Consultants Bill? You also fail to mention the money that went to the Rebels after that.

Senator REYNOLDS: Why did the board agree to write off that $13 million worth of loans?

Mr Pulver : Because we did a transaction to sell the entity to Imperium Sports Management.

Senator REYNOLDS: Can you tell us the details surrounding that.

Mr Pulver : The transaction?

Senator REYNOLDS: Yes.

Mr Pulver : No, I can't.

Senator REYNOLDS: That would be because?

Mr Pulver : It's confidential.

Rubbish Bill just tell the truth.

Senator REYNOLDS: We've been round that buoy several times. I want to ask you specifically, again: why did you write off that $13 million as part of the transfer?

Mr Pulver : Senator, what else would you have done with that?

Senator REYNOLDS: With respect, Mr Pulver, if you want to ask me questions, this is not the purpose of this. I'm asking you why the board wrote off that $13 million worth of loans.

Mr Pulver : We entered a relationship with a third party, the Imperium Sports Management group, in order to have them run the Melbourne Rebels. We did that hoping it would be a better financial outcome than the Victorian Rugby Union running it. When they came to us with that discussion, and you had to account for the historical losses, there was no way that a private entrepreneur was going to pay for those losses. So I'm not sure that we had any other alternative.

Of course you didn't ask the technically insolvent Andrew Cox to re-structure the debt. If a private entrepreneur isn't going to deal with the debt then why is he buying the club?

Senator REYNOLDS: So you did this because, basically, you didn't think the Rebels could survive without writing that debt off.

Mr Pulver : No; basically because we had to field five teams. Had the Australian Rugby Union had an option at that point in time to drop a team we probably would have considered it.

Senator REYNOLDS: At that time, in 2015, you entered into this agreement. You waived the $13 million worth of loans, which would have made them probably insolvent.

Mr Pulver : They weren't loans to Imperium Sports Management.

Senator REYNOLDS: I didn't say they were. They were to Melbourne Rebels, which you waived—that's very clear.

Mr Pulver : Yes.

Senator REYNOLDS: You then transferred the licence to Imperium for zero dollars. There have been a number of reports in the media about a figure of $6 million that was also transferred to Imperium to run the team. Is that correct?

Mr Pulver : I can't comment on that number. There was incremental funding—I'm happy to confirm that—but the details of the numbers are confidential.

Nonsense Bill. The whole idea of private ownership Bill is so that the Rebels can finance themselves and other stakeholders in Australian Rugby need to know how much you have wasted on this vanity project.

Senator REYNOLDS: Incremental and front-end loaded.

Mr Pulver : This enterprise had lost a considerable amount of money. A new owner was taking ownership. We wanted to support that new ownership but then normalise it over a period of time.

Senator REYNOLDS: So the answer to that is yes, extra money was paid—

Mr Pulver : That's correct.

Why didn't you just close them down Bill and restart them with a newCO under an alliance agreement? The Rebels winding up is Andrew Cox's problem not yours.

Senator REYNOLDS: Here we go again! However you want to describe it, what is being put to me and this committee is that there was a sum of around $6 million. Whether it was paid incrementally, whether it was—whatever—there was a sum directly related to that transaction: the loan write-offs, the $1. That money went to Imperium to support the Rebels.

Mr Pulver : Is there a question in there, Senator?

Senator REYNOLDS: Is that true? Did money go?

Mr Pulver : Sorry, could you repeat the question?

Senator REYNOLDS: The question is: was there any direct money paid by the ARU to Imperium or to the Melbourne Rebels as a result of that transaction?

Mr Pulver : We paid them the same $6 million of funding that went, roughly, to every Super Rugby club, and I'm happy to confirm that there was some incremental funding on top of that, which was—

Senator REYNOLDS: And how much was that?

Mr Pulver : I can't tell you that.

Senator SMITH: You can't tell us the individual amounts or you can't tell us the quantum amount?

Mr Pulver : It's a confidential agreement with Imperium Sports Management. You can sit up there and laugh at that point, senators, but surely you appreciate—

Senator SMITH: No, no.

Senator REYNOLDS: We're not laughing. Mr Pulver, let me tell you, we're not laughing.

Mr Pulver : I am taking offence at an issue of a confidential agreement. Surely, senators, you appreciate that.

Senator SMITH: Mr Pulver, no-one mocked your comment about the confidentiality. No-one mocked your comment.

Mr Pulver : I can't hear that in the room when there are chuckles from your side of the table.

Senator SMITH: Mr Pulver—no, excuse me—

CHAIR: I beg your pardon, there was not. There were some comments from the audience but not from us. I'm, quite frankly, incredulous that given you came here saying that you were prepared to be transparent we can't find out this information. It is very important for the inquiry. There are issues that this inquiry's been set up to deal with and it's very important. One of the key issues that directly relates to the financial viability of the Rebels, we can't find out.

Mr Pulver : Senator, you've got two options here. We can go into private session, but essentially you're asking me to breach a confidential agreement that I've signed, and I think you understand the implications of that.

You were being evasive and childish that's why they laughed at you Bill. The Chair is running the Inquiry and not you.

Senator REYNOLDS: The same governance model you've said you spent five years trying to reform.

Mr Pulver : The governance model at the ARU level is excellent, in my view, with an independent nominations committee appointing an independent board. The reforms I'm looking for are for governance at lower levels within the game.

No it is shite Bill and run by Cameron's mates from Sydney Uni.

Senator REYNOLDS: Of the last three years, where we could break down the numbers, the Western Force in total got just over $15 million, and the Rebels got $33 million from ARU, and they also got the extra bonus of the $13 million write-off. That's correct? To round it down, it is $46 million.

Mr Pulver : Senator, you're just throwing numbers at me, and I'm happy to take them on notice and provide explanations of them.

Senator REYNOLDS: Well, I'm happy to provide my table. I'm a bit surprised that the CEO doesn't recognise his own financial figures. But would you like me to give you a copy?

Mr Pulver : The variance to regular funding agreements is largely driven by the $28 million of unbudgeted funding.

Yet you cry poor to the RFU and the IRB over gate revenue sharing and losses in RWC years. Good on the IRB and RFU for refusing to fund the Rebels wastage scheme.

Senator REYNOLDS: In your spreadsheet and in your analysis that you're going to table, what weighting was the fact that they haven't been financially viable—

Mr Pulver : The primary weighting was looking forward, not looking backwards.

Irresponsible Bill

Senator REYNOLDS: Can you confirm that Mr Winney—and you had correspondence with—I'm not asking for the detail of it, but just in 2014, BidCo and Mr Winney approached you, and you had discussions, negotiations and correspondence with them about the opportunity—

Mr Pulver : No, I'm not prepared to comment.

Senator REYNOLDS: You can't even comment on whether someone contacted you?

Mr Pulver : I'm not prepared to comment on private discussions I've had with anybody where I have not sought approval to release that information to a Senate inquiry.

Senator REYNOLDS: So, say you had received—

Mr Pulver : Senator, am I at liberty to ask the relevance of this in the context of this inquiry?

Senator REYNOLDS: You can, but if you're not going to even answer any questions in relation to an approach you had in 2014 from BidCo, who made an offer, as I understand, to enter into negotiations with ARU to take over the Melbourne Rebels licence, in quite different terms from zero consideration, I'm just wondering—I think that's absolutely relevant, because if they were in financial trouble in 2015, which clearly they were—

Mr Pulver : Excuse me, could you explain which term of reference this is relevant to, Senator?

Did you read the last term of reference Bill?

Senator REYNOLDS: Pretty much all of them because, if you go to your response to us, ARU is faced with insolvency and you have very clearly in your evidence said that one of the main contributors to your insolvency is the $28 million, the underperformance and the financial issues that the Melbourne Rebels had. So it is then logical to ask: was Imperium the only group that you negotiated with; and how did you end up going into that deal with Imperium where you wrote off $13 million worth of loans? You just said that they were responsible for $20 million of your forecast debt. So it is absolutely on point to ask what other negotiations you had. Were there any other interested parties? Were there any other deals that you could have done? As you said, you were in negotiations with the Victorian government, which you've also refused to answer with regard to the terms that they offered. That is directly relevant. So I'll ask you again: did you have any negotiations or discussions? Did anyone approach you or did you approach anybody else, apart from Imperium, about looking at taking over the licence of the Melbourne Rebels?

Mr Pulver : There were other discussions that I had around the country around Super Rugby ownership, none of which I'm prepared to discuss with this committee.

Yet you were happy to comment to your media mates about centralisation and strategic alliances.

Senator REYNOLDS: In terms of transparency for the sport—because, clearly, there was something going on with the Melbourne Rebels back in 2015 and before that led to those debts, which led to the debts that you have identified are the reason you got rid of Western Force—what actions did you take back in 2015—

Mr Pulver : Senator, you're putting words into my mouth. The primary focus of our analysis is looking at the financial forecasts, not the financial history.

What financial forecasts apart from bailouts and Vic Government donations do the Rebels have Bill?

Mr Pulver : I find it extraordinary that you're prepared to ignore the realities of confidentiality in agreements like those.

Senator REYNOLDS: On what basis are they—

Mr Pulver : The same basis that my contracts with the Western Australian government are confidential.

Don't bring the WA Government in to defending your collusion with Cox, Bill.

Senator REYNOLDS: We're aware of that. How did that meeting in Adelaide come about then? You're the CEO. You weren't there. You must have some knowledge about—

Mr Pulver : Andrew Forrest had a conversation with my chairman, Mr Cameron Clyne. Mr Forrest wanted Cameron and members of our board to fly to Perth. Essentially, they agreed to meet in Adelaide.

Met in Adelaide so they didn't soil their underwear in Perth in front of a lynch mob.

Senator REYNOLDS: Have you talked to Mr Clyne since? I know he's overseas, so he couldn't be here today. What was his reaction to the meeting? Why did ARU say 'no'?

Mr Pulver : Actually, my chairman came back from that meeting saying that it was quite an encouraging meeting because he felt that he and our members of the board had had an opportunity to explain why we were where we were with Super Rugby. But he got the sense that Mr Forrest was quite serious about future investment in the game.

Overseas to avoid going to Perth.

Senator REYNOLDS: Unlikely or impossible? If you're not saying it was impossible, what would it have taken at that meeting to save Western Force?

Mr Pulver : Basically, I think it was possibly—it may have been close to impossible. At that point, the ownership of the Melbourne Rebels had changed hands. It was still not impossible because, even post the change of ownership, there may have been an insolvency event. So it wasn't actually impossible and it was clearly worth taking the meeting.

Sold it to a state union that is struggling to stay in the black is very responsible behaviour.

Senator REYNOLDS: If, when Andrew Forrest and others went over to meet with Mr Clyne in Adelaide, it was already impossible for the Western Force to be reinstated, is it your understanding that the ARU or Mr Clyne made it clear to RugbyWA and Andrew Forrest at that point in time that there was no going back?

Mr Pulver : I wasn't in the meeting, so I'd just be speculating. But I think Mr Clyne made it very—

A pathological liar like de Clyne doesn't make it very clear Bill.

Senator REYNOLDS: While you've said that you've shut the Western Force down and there's no possibility now of it coming back—

Mr Pulver : Which happened last week.

How convenient Bill.

Senator REYNOLDS: what would happen if everyone's dreams came true, you sorted out funding and SANZAAR agreed to that? Could the Western Force still come back? Could you actually reinitiate the licence?

Mr Pulver : No. Basically, at the point that Mr Forrest became involved in the debate, it was pretty well over. This is hypothetical, but, had Mr Forrest come into this discussion six months ago and, effectively, funded our purchase of the Melbourne Rebels licence, it may well have been a very different story. But, unfortunately, that is not how it unfolded.

Senator REYNOLDS: Had the ARU given a loan to the Western Force like they did to the Melbourne Rebels, that would've meant that the Western Force could have continued—is that correct?

Mr Pulver : Yes.

Rubbish Bill wouldn't have mattered as the Rebels were never going to closed down.

Senator REYNOLDS: Did you offer a loan?

Mr Pulver : I don't recall it being asked for.

Bs Bill.

[BLR]

The Rebels were owned by a private company so there was that confidentiality while the ARU owned the Force license so they can do whatever the hell they want.

I would think that would be the distinction made.

[Bakkies]

Imperium have company financial records online in NZ with an Australian address which are linked to ASIC due to bilateral arrangements (they have to provide their ACN and ABN to NZ) yet there are very few if at all books filed online in Australia with the regulator.

[sandgroperrugby]

ARU management use of whataboutism https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=60vpBrKcr0U

[SPaRTAN]

It's only confidential when it suits him.



This is the same fellow that said that the RA was facing insolvency, the organisation has run losses and they were handing out millions like chump change to the Rebels that was never going to be paid back. How can you say have no debt...



That's a lie. He could have answered it was going to the Rebels and Reds as that would be more truthful.



Correct Senator Reynolds he knows where it is going and sweet fa will go to community Rugby.



Did you bother to ask him or did you get your mate Cameron to ask him?



Yet his technically insolvent books are available online in NZ for the world to see and cheaper than the two sales of the Rabble to the VRU.



C'mon on Bill you never did due diligence.



Yet you made sure it didn't go back to the RA even though you will be funding it.



A beggar off the street would give you a dollar if you weren't willing to cough up Bill.



You had an alliance agreement with them to donate money freely despite their 'private ownership.'



Straight out lie about being insolvent especially when you don't know the definition of insolvent, debt and loans. If the Force, etc were actually insolvent the directors would have had to put their organisations under voluntary administration as per the responsibility. A responsibility that you should be aware of as the RA CEO.

Your mate the bum Anthony French also said the Brumbies were facing insolvency which was also nonsense.



Don't you mean fund the Rebels private owner? Your mate hooked him up with the deal of the century and the RA were donating money to cover debts.



Yet the Brumbies have had years with more season ticket holders than your second team the Tahs, Bill. Throw in higher sponsorship deals. As for the snide comment about politicians towards politicians Canberra is mostly full of politicians from your second home Bill, NSW.



Didn't the WA Government say that the Force were the main reason why NIB Stadium went under redevelopment?



The Vic Gov't is propped up by tax payers Bill so they are entitled to know what is going down the bottomless pit. The Federal Government who you were talking to face to face also provide GST money towards Victoria so if GST money is going to the Rebels they are entitled to know what it was wasted on.



A secret that is on a secret that you won't release to their masters.



No it isn't Bill. Look who you sent over to Perth in April.



What about the 'loans' that you dished out after Teflon John resigned?



What about the money you wasted on Consultants Bill? You also fail to mention the money that went to the Rebels after that.



Rubbish Bill just tell the truth.



Of course you didn't ask the technically insolvent Andrew Cox to re-structure the debt. If a private entrepreneur isn't going to deal with the debt then why is he buying the club?



Nonsense Bill. The whole idea of private ownership Bill is so that the Rebels can finance themselves and other stakeholders in Australian Rugby need to know how much you have wasted on this vanity project.



Why didn't you just close them down Bill and restart them with a newCO under an alliance agreement? The Rebels winding up is Andrew Cox's problem not yours.



You were being evasive and childish that's why they laughed at you Bill. The Chair is running the Inquiry and not you.



No it is shite Bill and run by Cameron's mates from Sydney Uni.



Yet you cry poor to the RFU and the IRB over gate revenue sharing and losses in RWC years. Good on the IRB and RFU for refusing to fund the Rebels wastage scheme.



Irresponsible Bill



Did you read the last term of reference Bill?



Yet you were happy to comment to your media mates about centralisation and strategic alliances.



What financial forecasts apart from bailouts and Vic Government donations do the Rebels have Bill?



Don't bring the WA Government in to defending your collusion with Cox, Bill.



Met in Adelaide so they didn't soil their underwear in Perth in front of a lynch mob.



Overseas to avoid going to Perth.



Sold it to a state union that is struggling to stay in the black is very responsible behaviour.



A pathological liar like de Clyne doesn't make it very clear Bill.



How convenient Bill.



Rubbish Bill wouldn't have mattered as the Rebels were never going to closed down.



Bs Bill.

Makes for really depressing reading.

I really hope the senate go after the RA, if they don't it sets a precedent that you can basically sit up there being all smug and be as dishonest as you like and it doesn't even matter because you wont even get a smack around the wrist. The senate really needs to make a move on these ass clowns, and ASIC really need to start taking some pot shots. It is starting to feel like nothing has happened despite the Inquiry running its course.

[GIGS20]

Makes for really depressing reading.

I really hope the senate go after the RA, if they don't it sets a precedent that you can basically sit up there being all smug and be as dishonest as you like and it doesn't even matter because you wont even get a smack around the wrist. The senate really needs to make a move on these ass clowns, and ASIC really need to start taking some pot shots. It is starting to feel like nothing has happened despite the Inquiry running its course.

Without wanting to be a dick, the Senate has done all they can. It's now up to other agencies to follow through on the good start.

ASIC appears to be in the loop, so hopefully they will go pretty hard, but I wouldn't expect that to be quick.
THe ASC also have a part to play in the governance issues, but they won't move until the government has responded to the report....sometime next year at the soonest.
the WA Government were already seeking legal advice on the promises which lead them to believe spending $100 Mill was a good idea, but I suspect we won;t hear anything until a court date is announced and nothing if they can't build a case.

I think that covers all the recommendations doesn't it?

Assuming there's nothing else, we'd all better sit tight and prepare for a long wait.

[Jules]

Hey if anyone can get in contact with Jodi Hodgson, could she email Oliver Peterson from 6PR he would like to discuss the issue with her.

His email is oliver.peterson@macquariemedia.com.au

Did this happen?

[Bakkies]

Without wanting to be a dick, the Senate has done all they can. It's now up to other agencies to follow through on the good start.

ASIC appears to be in the loop, so hopefully they will go pretty hard, but I wouldn't expect that to be quick.
THe ASC also have a part to play in the governance issues, but they won't move until the government has responded to the report....sometime next year at the soonest.
the WA Government were already seeking legal advice on the promises which lead them to believe spending $100 Mill was a good idea, but I suspect we won;t hear anything until a court date is announced and nothing if they can't build a case.

I think that covers all the recommendations doesn't it?

Assuming there's nothing else, we'd all better sit tight and prepare for a long wait.

Actually the Senate hasn't finished yet. They have made the ASIC financial reports and the minutes from the infamous August 18th 2016 meeting which I believe Hansie was after a few months back, public on the Inquiry website only recently. Reynolds also recommended that the behaviour of certain witnesses during the investigation be looked at which should be the responsibility of the Senate (might not be the same committee) to look at.

The ASIC recommendation is based upon on the evidence brought to the Inquiry it doesn't look it is done yet as Nick Taylor is doing a good job digging in to those emails.

[UAUdiver1959]

How much of this are we going to take? I’m sure Mark McGowan and Twiggy don’t like being shafted at every turn. Whilst we take it and do nothing the RA will keep stomping on us. They are the bully. They have taken our lunch money (gst) now push us around at will.

[terrycobner]

How much of this are we going to take? I’m sure Mark McGowan and Twiggy don’t like being shafted at every turn. Whilst we take it and do nothing the RA will keep stomping on us. They are the bully. They have taken our lunch money (gst) now push us around at will.

We have to leave the RA as a necessity! What would we need to do to get expelled?
Guys, it is time to forget about the RA. Forget about wallabies eligibility. Get sanctioned through asia rugby not australia.
Get the players pay the coin. Break super rugby.

[SPaRTAN]

We have to leave the RA as a necessity! What would we need to do to get expelled?
Guys, it is time to forget about the RA. Forget about wallabies eligibility. Get sanctioned through asia rugby not australia.
Get the players pay the coin. Break super rugby.

Have to agree with that. I wish we could just end this misery and move on (without those Rats Assholes)

[mothy]

Jules I listened but nothing happened. He had a full schedule although he did say he was going to mention it. Maybe ring in he likes to bounce off caller comments.