How Twiggy will run his rebel rugby comp

[Bakkies]

At least in its current form! I certainly want to be there when the Western Force win the gf in whatever league the Warratahs and Reds are playing in, don't care what it's called, just want the payback.

Found this gem of an article from back in the day


Five players may go as Tahs consider cull

Josh Rakic | May 10, 2009

WARATAHS players won't be spared in the current financial crisis, with as many as five players likely to be cut from the squad of 33 to help to ease financial burden.
Fringe Super 14 player Peter Playford is believed to be among the unlucky nominees to lose a spot.
The Queensland Reds set the trend this year by reducing their roster to 32, having foreseen financial hardship. Queensland Rugby Union chairman Peter Lewis told The Sun-Herald economic times would get tougher and he expected a move to cut five players would save the Waratahs about half a million dollars a season, when salaries and other expenses were taken into account.
"In round figures, you're looking at $100,000 a hit per player, so there's half a million straight on the bottom line," Lewis said. "It's a reality that every Super club has to face, absolutely.
"The Reds took a conscious decision early in the year that if we can live with 32 we will, but we might have to live with 28 or 30.
"Rugby is a luxury item and when people look at their budgets it's very easy to cut your pay TV subscription and your football tickets, which unfortunately funnels down to the players in the end.
"It's tough times and you've got to cut your costs. The decision on who to cut is the coach's prerogative, at least at the Reds, but it's a tough call whichever way you go.
"All finances are well and truly under the microscope. The pressure's on, there's no question, because next year will be a lot tougher than this."
As with the Waratahs, the Reds are backing a move to have the Australian teams play each other twice a season.
As many as 20 players with Super rugby experience could be free agents in 2010. However, Lewis said a fifth Australian team was not an option to boost earnings, corporate and fan support.
"The only input clubs have had in the coming SANZAR meeting is that we've made two things very clear," Lewis said. "We desperately want an expansion of the competition, particularly more local derbies, which are critical to our financial success. And we want the ARU to be very careful about a fifth Australian team because I don't think we have the manpower to successfully build a fifth team.
"We don't want our teams raked over again like what happened when they set up Perth.
"Even look at the Super 14 now, Australia's struggling to get one team in the top four. That tells you that we're not as good as we should be with four teams. How are we going to be if we spread it over five teams?"
Lewis is, however, in favour of a fifth Australia-based team, with rumours circling that a hybrid team made up of predominantly Islander and Japanese players could be based on the Gold Coast.
"Personally, I'd like to see Argentina more engaged, with a team based out of Brisbane or the Gold Coast for four months of the year," Lewis said.
"They came third in the World Cup and they're not involved in any major domestic competition - Super 14 or Six Nations. They're the third-best country in the world and we don't see enough of them.
"But if it does happen and if we do get a longer season, clubs are going to have to hope they can make do with fewer players. Things aren't getting any easier."

[Bakkies]

The ARU and NZRU provided a Trans Tasman option to broadcasters in 2009 who were quiet keen. The same man is still in charge of the NZRU (Tew) is now against it despite SA again looking to Europe. In 2009 the Sharks and Stormers were keen to move to Europe. This time SA have backed up their words with actions by moving two teams to Europe to test the waters, discussing seriously about introducing two more pro teams to move to Europe and put the boot in to the ARU in regards to their actions at the table.

The NZRU remain teflon in all of this farce.


The future of Super Rugby is clearly on a knife edge as New Zealand and Australia explained the stumbling blocks to the tournament continuing with South African involvement. In a rare showing of public tit-for-tat Australia and New Zealand were moved on Friday to reply to South Africa's version of the impasses that had been aired earlier in the day by the media.
It does not look good no matter what side of the fence you sit on.
It will take some major bridge-building over the next two months to save Super Rugby beyond 2010.
But the tone of the week and the utmost urgency of the matter tend to count against that.
The guts of the problem is that New Zealand and Australia don't want to start an expanded Super 15 in February when South Africa do.
South Africa don't want to play Super Rugby in conjunction with tests matches in June while New Zealand and Australia do.
"They believe we need to give and Australia and New Zealand believe they (South Africa) need to give," said NZRU chief executive Steve Tew.
"We are acknowledging that the impasse is still there and ... the clock is ticking."
Earlier South African Rugby Union acting managing director Andy Marinos suggested arbitration or mediation might be needed to sort things out.
As a united front of all three countries Sanzar must present their competition proposal for a new broadcasting deal to News Ltd and SuperSport by June 30.
As the divide appears to widen New Zealand and Australia are now well into planning an Asia-Pacific alternative that might start as a trans-Tasman affair while South Africa explore options in time zone-friendly Europe.
New Zealand and Australia have sounded out TV interest and begun talks with Japan.
Tew said the Japanese talks were "a lot more positive" than earlier discussions. He felt that while a 2011 start might be too soon for them they could possibly come up with two teams towards the end of any new five-year deal.
The Pacific Islands and North America also had to be considered but so did economic realities. He doubted North American involvement in the opening stage of a new championship.

New Zealand and Australian officials met in Sydney for two days this week. They said "talks will continue on an alternative plan, an Asia-Pacific competition, to ensure a valuable and viable tournament is ready for implementation should resolution not be reached with South Africa on Super Rugby expansion plans."
But Tew said the preferred option for everyone was for Super Rugby to continue as a three-way championship with Australia, New Zealand and South Africa.
He emphasised that the Tri-Nations - and possible expansion with Argentina - would not be affected by the Super Rugby impasse.
While Tew was insistent on the degree of hope for South Africa's involvement in Super Rugby his frustration was evident.
The next opportunity the three countries have to get together looks like being around an IRB council meeting in Dublin in a fortnight.
While South Africa's economic attraction was massive, Tew said looking at replacing those dollars elsewhere was "possibly not as scary as initially first thought".
In a joint statement the NZRU and ARU said they acknowledge that the June window presents a challenge, but believe a viable solution exists which would treat all teams in the competition in the same way.
They say they are determined to deliver a competition of the highest integrity to supporters and broadcasters and believe South African calls for further compromise will impact on that commitment.
New Zealand and Australia feel that Super Rugby can continue through June but with less matches each weekend through the scheduling of additional byes. In this way all teams in the competition would play two matches over the four weeks that the test players were unavailable.
They say that it is consistent with the approach in Europe - where the key rugby competitions continue during the November test window and during the Six Nations Championship - and with competition structures in other codes including rugby league and football.
SA Rugby's revised solution involves a mid-February start to Super Rugby - to avoid encroaching on the Currie Cup at the back end of the season - as opposed to the preference of Australia and New Zealand for a March kick off.
South Africa has also suggested their teams could open the Super Rugby season with local derbies, at least two weeks before New Zealand and Australian provinces begin their season campaigns.
NZRU and ARU say a staggered start would not appeal to fans and broadcasters.
Tew said New Zealand provincial unions had not yet been involved in discussions on the latest alternative plans.
He wondered if New Zealand could sustain any more than the current five franchises, particularly given the economic climate.
Tew said shifting the June tests wasn't an option. It had been rejected by the northern hemisphere unions and despite concerns about the touring teams there were massive economic benefiots, mainly through the attraction of the All Blacks.
At the same time that Tew was addressing a laarge contingent of New Zealand media via a phone conference Australian boss John O'Neill told Australian media that a two-round trans-Tasman competition could start without complications and may include two Japanese teams in the future.
"We didn't start all this with a trans-Tasman option but it's a functional option and (broadcasters) find it quite attractive," he said.
The ARU are committed to a fifth Australian team with Melbourne the favourite ahead of Gold Coast to win a potential licence.
"You could add one more team or three more teams and make it a Super 10 or Super 12. Down the track you could have two teams based in Japan," O'Neill said.
"It's time zone friendly. If you played two rounds which you would have to (to make 22 weeks) you would have an avalanche of local derbies."

[Alison]

The ARU only have themselves to blame for the current lamentable situation. The decision to issue the 5th licence was financially irresponsible and the Force ended up paying the price for that. F U ARU

[Bakkies]

The ARU only have themselves to blame for the current lamentable situation. The decision to issue the 5th licence was financially irresponsible and the Force ended up paying the price for that. F U ARU

Absolutely the ARU are a basketcase but the NZRU shouldn't be allowed to sit on the side line with nothing to say and they may leave with an empty hand due to the calls in SA and Australia to end Super Rugby.

[BLR]

Absolutely the ARU are a basketcase but the NZRU shouldn't be allowed to sit on the side line with nothing to say and they may leave with an empty hand due to the calls in SA and Australia to end Super Rugby.

They aren't on the sidelines, they are the ones that pushed for the cull in the first place. They orchestrated the whole mess and we let them fuck us.

[mothy]

I’m sure this has been already touched on and there is a lot of water to go under the bridge and years of development ahead for rugby.

My question is as a Force fan who lives in hope! – if the IPRC was to succeed over time. Could it be possible like I heard Rod kaffer say be a second level club comp to Super rugby with a relegation and promotion component something like happens in the EPL?

Therefore working on a formula of bottom teams being relegated to the IPRC and the top teams being promoted to the super rugby comp.

It would create more interest and be incentive for all teams to fight for their position on the ladder both at the top and bottom.

It would probably see lots of player movement and create incentives in the IPRC for clubs to invest in players who could get them into the promotion zone.

The whole thing would be more cut throat as teams fight for survival.

15 is a good number in this scenario the only down side is finance. As i’m not sure how it would work with a conference system. Unless you play each other once and your conference teams twice.

Look – I know this could be pie in the sky stuff but if it worked I think it would add a lot of interest to spectators and broadcasters with so much at stake. New broad cast deals are required in 2020 would that be a game changer for sponsors, broadcasters and alternative broadcasting avenues like streaming?

Any thoughts ? Especially positive ones would be nice 🙂

[SNOB]

They aren't on the sidelines, they are the ones that pushed for the cull in the first place. They orchestrated the whole mess and we let them fuck us.

And from 2020 they will have no one to play with!

[sittingbison]

... over time. Could it be possible like I heard Rod kaffer say be a second level club comp to Super rugby with a relegation and promotion component something like happens in the EPL?

Therefore working on a formula of bottom teams being relegated to the IPRC and the top teams being promoted to the super rugby comp.

It would create more interest and be incentive for all teams to fight for their position on the ladder both at the top and bottom.

It would probably see lots of player movement and create incentives in the IPRC for clubs to invest in players who could get them into the promotion zone...

You could have two tiers in Super, a cup and plate, with relegation and promotion of three teams. And also two tiers in IPRC, again with relegation and promotion of three teams.

The beauty is that within two years Reds Tahrds and Rebels would all be in the IPRC plate

[.X.]

You could have two tiers in Super, a cup and plate, with relegation and promotion of three teams. And also two tiers in IPRC, again with relegation and promotion of three teams.

The beauty is that within two years Reds Tahrds and Rebels would all be in the IPRC plate

If you really think that the ERU would allow for the Tahs to be relegated to Plate - even if the lost every single game they played in a season.

Ive got this bridge for sale, in Sydney harbor. beautiful views. Very popular.

[blueandblack]

If you really think that the ERU would allow for the Tahs to be relegated to Plate - even if the lost every single game they played in a season.

Ive got this bridge for sale, in Sydney harbor. beautiful views. Very popular.

and a House nearby to view it from?

[GIGS20]

If you really think that the ERU would allow for the Tahs to be relegated to Plate - even if the lost every single game they played in a season.

I read the five things we learned from the Springbok draw last night, there was an indication of how the language would look.

Apparently that was the best they've played all year.
Bernard Foley is the best thing since sliced bread and any obvious failing in his game were as a result of his problems with concussion
Israel Folau is amazing
The team is second on the table and that position is well deserved
They can play a lot better than they currently are and the secret is confidence (which I assume is a lot like intensity)

[SinBin]

.. Could it be possible like I heard .... be a second level club comp to Super rugby with a relegation and promotion component something like happens in the EPL? Therefore working on a formula of bottom teams being relegated to the IPRC and the top teams being promoted to the super rugby comp.
It would create more interest and be incentive for all teams to fight for their position on the ladder both at the top and bottom.
It would probably see lots of player movement and create incentives in the IPRC for clubs to invest in players who could get them into the promotion zone.
The whole thing would be more cut throat as teams fight for survival. 15 is a good number in this scenario the only down side is finance. As i’m not sure how it would work with a conference system. Unless you play each other once and your conference teams twice.
Look – I know this could be pie in the sky stuff but if it worked I think it would add a lot of interest to spectators and broadcasters with so much at stake. New broad cast deals are required in 2020 would that be a game changer for sponsors, broadcasters and alternative broadcasting avenues like streaming?
Any thoughts ? Especially positive ones would be nice 🙂

Being an active supporter of an EPL team that's bounced back and forth from the EPL>Championship>EPL, I can confirm that the threat of relegation (Down) AND the prospect of promotion (Up) creates huge interest/tribalism/broadcasting opportunities. I think Sheikh (Wigan?) can confirm that also plus any Leeds, Villa, Fulhum etc supporters on the site.

But, you have to have a bona fide centralised system which unfortunately we will never have under the corrupt/morally "bankrupt" administration we have now. You've mentioned 15 being the perfect number. Running a two tier comp over three countries would be logistically impossible under the current umbrella organisation (SANZAR/SANZAAR)

[Bakkies]

Being an active supporter of an EPL team that's bounced back and forth from the EPL>Championship>EPL, I can confirm that the threat of relegation (Down) AND the prospect of promotion (Up) creates huge interest/tribalism/broadcasting opportunities. I think Sheikh (Wigan?) can confirm that also plus any Leeds, Villa, Fulhum etc supporters on the site.

But, you have to have a bona fide centralised system which unfortunately we will never have under the corrupt/morally "bankrupt" administration we have now. You've mentioned 15 being the perfect number. Running a two tier comp over three countries would be logistically impossible under the current umbrella organisation (SANZAR/SANZAAR)

Relegation doesn't create huge opportunities in Rugby it nearly put the Lions out of business. They had to cancel matches because they couldn't afford to travel. It has been disastrous for Biarritz and they haven't been able to get back up.

[SinBin]

Relegation doesn't create huge opportunities in Rugby it nearly put the Lions out of business. They had to cancel matches because they couldn't afford to travel. It has been disastrous for Biarritz and they haven't been able to get back up.

Fair calls but are SA and France's rugby systems the same as "football" in the UK, I doubt it. Re Biarritz, ask Leeds supporters if it's a walk in the park to get back up to the premier league - 13 years and counting but each year they get closer and I hope they make it back to where they ultimately belong.

There is absolutely no denying that the English Football League system has one of the most successful competitions in the world - albeit, tough as hell to get promoted but that's how it should be. If only rugby here could adopt a similar blueprint - that's what Mothy was proposing (2 tier comp).

[Bakkies]

Fair calls but are SA and France's rugby systems the same as "football" in the UK, I doubt it. Re Biarritz, ask Leeds supporters if it's a walk in the park to get back up to the premier league - 13 years and counting but each year they get closer and I hope they make it back to where they ultimately belong.

There is absolutely no denying that the English Football League system has one of the most successful competitions in the world - albeit, tough as hell to get promoted but that's how it should be. If only rugby here could adopt a similar blueprint - that's what Mothy was proposing (2 tier comp).

Leeds received financial relegation due to Rebels style mismanagement and they have been paying out managers who have barely been there over two months.

Pro D2 is hard to get out of. Biarritz and Perpignan both went down in the same season 2013-14. Unlike Football in the UK in France clubs have to meet financial audits and can only spend a percentage of their budget on wages. If they don't they get relegated and/or points deductions.