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Thread: Force set to be axed

  1. #661
    Player lou's Avatar
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    And Rob Clarke is back in Melbourne advising the Rebels again - for a fee

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  2. #662
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    Further evidence of collusion and that the decision was made a long long time ago.

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  3. #663
    Immortal GIGS20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hansie View Post
    Further evidence of collusion and that the decision was made a long long time ago.
    Maybe, but I would call it further evidence of the desire of the ARU to pare down to 3 teams in the medium term. Kill the Force by any means possible, then let the Rebels bankrupt themselves using the same two wankers who have been killing them for years.

    Surely a corruption inquiry can't be far away?

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  4. #664
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    Quote Originally Posted by GIGS20 View Post
    Maybe, but I would call it further evidence of the desire of the ARU to pare down to 3 teams in the medium term. Kill the Force by any means possible, then let the Rebels bankrupt themselves using the same two wankers who have been killing them for years.

    Surely a corruption inquiry can't be far away?
    So around the traps I've heard a few things the last few days.

    On the desire to quit the Force

    - ARU have been looking to close down the Force for a number of years
    - Corporate Melbourne long term is worth more than any corporate advantage they get from the Force
    - Rugby viewerships on TV for games involving the Force is not huge, with the lack of corporate advantages over Melbourne minimised
    - Will Genia as a signing shows they want to do a similar pathway to the Melbourne Storm which hopefully grows the pie bigger for the entire country.

    Problems for the ARU

    - In ten years time where does Australian Rugby see itself?
    - Where do the future Wallabies come from, with the massacres going on in school level in Brisbane and Sydney, the new territory of Perth that was now starting to have MAJOR inroads into the public high schools of Perth is lost, but also the massacres of Sydney and Brisbane are not being reversed. Does Melbourne bring in more future Wallabies and growth to offset Perth? I doubt it
    - The West Australian Government/Rugby WA are not going to take it lying down based on the characteristics of the current government/the board of Rugby WA which is full of the mining sector experience, these people are expert litigators.

    Process going forward

    - The ARU continue to pursue legal challenges for the benefit they see of long term revenue increases for Australian Rugby
    - They look at a compromise deal that sees that outside of corporate interest, in a ten year framework it desperately needs to ensure the players being developed in new territories of Perth to ensure the country stays a top 10 international side

    Conclusion

    In the best long term interest, forgetting about the mistakes of the Force (which there have been many) is a legal process that goes on for months and months the best solution for this crisis.

    There will be people in Australian Rugby that read this forum, the need to find a compromise is earnest for the games long term future. Both parties, Western Australia and the ARU are not in the mood for compromise, which will damage the game nationally if the ARU believes there is no risk to this litigation until they get rid of the Force mentality.

    We may just throw away our chances of winning the World Cup in the next 20 years.

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  5. #665
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    Quote Originally Posted by Egan View Post
    if the ARU believes there is no risk to this litigation until they get rid of the Force mentality.
    Wow, that one sentence made me pause.

    Is that my big sticking point? the fact that the ARU are blindly chasing something that I disagree with passionately. It just might be.

    If the ARU were willing to rationally sit down and find a solution with which both parties are happy would I want RugbyWA to give a little?

    In writing that sentence, you know I think I might. I would certainly be open to the discussion, that discussion might not actually find a solution, but I think I'd feel a lot better about the process.

    Hansie, John, as two of the people in the crosshairs of the ARU, would you be willing to concede some ground if the ARU were genuinely interested in negotiating a favourable way out of this or has it just gone too far now?

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  6. #666
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    The thing is that the conversation should've been had towards the end of last year with all the teams.
    The ARU should've realised that their accounts were looking grim and something needed to change, so brought all of the parties together and notified them of this and the likely consequences. Then they could've all worked together to come to a solution (or at least the force, rebels and brumbies likely would have as they would know they were the most vulnerable).

    Instead, the ARU just did all their 'analysis' behind closed doors and came to the conclusion that one team had to go without consulting any of the other stakeholders and offering them the chance to rectify the situation. So then they fronted up to SANZAAR with the proposal to cut us.

    But I guess what's done is done, and if some sort of compromise could be reached then that would be better than nothing. I don't see that happening however since the ARU doesn't seem to be willing to take call or meet with the likes of Twiggy, the WA government, etc.

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  7. #667
    Legend Contributor blueandblack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GIGS20 View Post
    ....
    Hansie, John, as two of the people in the crosshairs of the ARU, would you be willing to concede some ground if the ARU were genuinely interested in negotiating a favourable way out of this or has it just gone too far now?
    I'm not sure I could trust the ARU. They'd need to clean out the entire board and most of the organisation first.

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  8. #668
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    Quote Originally Posted by GIGS20 View Post
    Hansie, John, as two of the people in the crosshairs of the ARU, would you be willing to concede some ground if the ARU were genuinely interested in negotiating a favourable way out of this or has it just gone too far now?
    I think the problem is finding out a suitable compromise. What can we give the ARU that would make them happy but keep our team in the comp?

    Tell them we will stump up $20 million as a pay off figure?

    I don't want to get in the situation where they go 'fine, we will keep the Spirit but you can't have the Force' and that is seen as 'better than nothing'.

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  9. #669
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    Quote Originally Posted by BLR View Post
    I think the problem is finding out a suitable compromise. What can we give the ARU that would make them happy but keep our team in the comp?

    Tell them we will stump up $20 million as a pay off figure?

    I don't want to get in the situation where they go 'fine, we will keep the Spirit but you can't have the Force' and that is seen as 'better than nothing'.
    Nick Farr Smith is to be congratulated for trying to get Force into the Sunwolves, they have the TV numbers, which we just unfortunately can't compete with.

    The world is about TV viewers, not the men and women turning up in the stadium. But TV viewers grow bigger with the Force helping to support Wallabies to take on the world.

    The argument has to be - What is the future of Australian Rugby if they continue to be massacred in Sydney and Brisbane and now lose all the hard work won by the Force in many high schools across Perth.

    This will then strategically align the strengths, with working with our overwhelming weakness - population.

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  10. #670
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    Quote Originally Posted by BLR View Post
    I think the problem is finding out a suitable compromise. What can we give the ARU that would make them happy but keep our team in the comp?

    Tell them we will stump up $20 million as a pay off figure?

    I don't want to get in the situation where they go 'fine, we will keep the Spirit but you can't have the Force' and that is seen as 'better than nothing'.
    Neither of those is the open, respectful, success focused dialogue I was thinking of. Both od those are what we have now, in which case, burn them! burn them all!

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  11. #671
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    There is a heap going on and as an example see this e-mail below sent to our warriors today.

    Dear Western Force Players,

    I am sure you are being kept updated by Sinders and RWA in relation to the Appeal due to be heard next Wednesday 23 August. If the appeal is upheld then the Western Force will be retained.

    I have been asked to send a personal message to you on behalf of Andrew Forrest. He has your back. He stands behind what he said on the field after the fabulous victory against the Waratahs. He will do whatever it takes to ensure the Western Force remain in the Super Rugby competition.

    Today Andrew has sent a letter to the ARU Board offering his full support to the Western Force, RugbyWA and rugby in general: “Win or lose the appeal, my support for the Western Force will not waiver and action to overturn your irresponsible decision will continue”. Andrew has called on the ARU management to meet with him to discuss overturning the decision to exterminate the Western Force and to “assist” them in making the right decision. If the ARU will not meet with him Andrew, he has called for the entire Board to resign and be replaced with leaders who are willing to act in the best interests of Australian rugby.

    Andrew also asked me to pass on in person to each and every ARU Director and the Chairman of NSW and QLD and ACT a simple message in addition to his letter: “I do not bluff. I never have. I never will. I will never give up”.

    As a former player I understand the current uncertainty around your future will be difficult. I am confident we will be successful in changing this decision. What will assist is your representative body, RUPA, coming out strongly alongside Andrew and RugbyWA. If ever there was a time for a players association to be relevant it is when 20% of its membership are lined up and shot without due process and without just cause. Please send a clear message through your representatives and directly to RUPA that you expect them to come out strongly and publicly in support of retention of the Western Force. There is no justifiable reason for the need to cut a team. Australian rugby can survive and thrive with 5 Super Rugby teams and that is the obvious solution regardless of the Appeal outcome. RUPA is in a strong position to be relevant in making the ARU change their decision.

    Andrew is fighting for you. I am fighting for you. Former RugbyWA Chairman and former ARU Director Geoff Stooke is fighting for you. RugbyWA is fighting for you. You, the players, need to get RUPA to fight for you.

    Be One. Be Strong.

    Go the Wallabies!

    Regards

    John Welborn

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  12. #672
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    Great words mayor but you forgot a couple of things, the fans are behind you, the clubs are behind you, the state government is behind you... Etc

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  13. #673
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    Unfortunately until now RUPA have been as much use as a chocolate teapot! Wasn't the FUARUs coaching messiah on the RUPA board?

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    May the FORCE be with you!

  14. #674
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    The concern I always have with RUPA is that they would like to retain five, so that there are enough spots for professional players. If the ARU announced they were going back to five tomorrow, with a team in Western Sydney or North Queensland, would RUPA's support for WA fall by the wayside?

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  15. #675
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    I emailed RUPA last week pretty much saying the below and demanding action. They didn't even take the time to reply.



    Quote Originally Posted by Hansie View Post
    There is a heap going on and as an example see this e-mail below sent to our warriors today.

    Dear Western Force Players,

    I am sure you are being kept updated by Sinders and RWA in relation to the Appeal due to be heard next Wednesday 23 August. If the appeal is upheld then the Western Force will be retained.

    I have been asked to send a personal message to you on behalf of Andrew Forrest. He has your back. He stands behind what he said on the field after the fabulous victory against the Waratahs. He will do whatever it takes to ensure the Western Force remain in the Super Rugby competition.

    Today Andrew has sent a letter to the ARU Board offering his full support to the Western Force, RugbyWA and rugby in general: “Win or lose the appeal, my support for the Western Force will not waiver and action to overturn your irresponsible decision will continue”. Andrew has called on the ARU management to meet with him to discuss overturning the decision to exterminate the Western Force and to “assist” them in making the right decision. If the ARU will not meet with him Andrew, he has called for the entire Board to resign and be replaced with leaders who are willing to act in the best interests of Australian rugby.

    Andrew also asked me to pass on in person to each and every ARU Director and the Chairman of NSW and QLD and ACT a simple message in addition to his letter: “I do not bluff. I never have. I never will. I will never give up”.

    As a former player I understand the current uncertainty around your future will be difficult. I am confident we will be successful in changing this decision. What will assist is your representative body, RUPA, coming out strongly alongside Andrew and RugbyWA. If ever there was a time for a players association to be relevant it is when 20% of its membership are lined up and shot without due process and without just cause. Please send a clear message through your representatives and directly to RUPA that you expect them to come out strongly and publicly in support of retention of the Western Force. There is no justifiable reason for the need to cut a team. Australian rugby can survive and thrive with 5 Super Rugby teams and that is the obvious solution regardless of the Appeal outcome. RUPA is in a strong position to be relevant in making the ARU change their decision.

    Andrew is fighting for you. I am fighting for you. Former RugbyWA Chairman and former ARU Director Geoff Stooke is fighting for you. RugbyWA is fighting for you. You, the players, need to get RUPA to fight for you.

    Be One. Be Strong.

    Go the Wallabies!

    Regards

    John Welborn

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