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Thread: FORCE SIDE NAMED FOR BATTLE WITH BRUMBIES

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by andrewg View Post
    Force v Brumbies - 20 to 30 Minutes - The Tide Turns

    By 22:00 the score board had moved onto F 0:17 B with a well-worked try resulting from a great Fardy run and offload to Toomua.

    The painful rugby continued and at 24:00 Lees on cue calls a KO advantage to the Force "over" even before they get a chance to get over the gain line. "Can we go back to the scrum please Sir?"
    By this stage the Brumbies had had 85% possession.

    26:00 - Fardy is penalised (P#1) for not supporting his weight. He is gobsmacked. The cloak has stopped working.

    26:22 - Tessman has a little hold of Moore's shirt at a ruck. Moore in disbelief that he's been touched by an upstart.

    26:49 - Penalty (P#2) goes against the Brumbies and eventually Cubelli gets YC'd for kicking the ball away. This results from Hodgo finally tired of the BS and tries to bring the kick to Lees' attention. Moore continues as his billigerent self and pushes Hodgo away with disdain. Hodgo doesn't want to lose the opportunity. Moore too is gobsmacked and just a bit rattled.

    29:16 Scrum penalty (P#3) against the Brumbies!!!!???? Hodgo doesn't take the easy points.

    29:30 Another penalty (P#4) against the Brumbies - Fardy for being off his feet (AGAIN) - 2nd in 5.5 minutes close to try line. AGAIN Hodgo is prevented getting access to the ball (for a quick start) as Moore picks it up and slowly walks across and places it at Lees' feet. Mouthing something like: "I don't know what HIS problem is!" The Sea of Blue were only too happy to explain it to both Moore and Lees. Hodgo takes the crap from Moore and Lees in his stride and again doesn't take the easy points

    Wth 4 penalties against the Brumbies in 3.5 minutes the tide turns, Moore is very rattled, Fardy on a final warning (and can't believe it) and the Force start to play some good rugby.

    There's a real invigoration arising from the Brumbies actually getting some penalties (now a bit more even at F7:6B).

    By end of 30 minutes, the Brumbies had had 93 Ruck Involvements compared to the Force's 59.

    Almost exactly the same as for the previous week - Brumbies 90 RIs v Waratahs 49 RIs. (Brumbies 8:5 Tahs)

    Finally at 30:00 we have a game on our hands. Over the next 50 minutes both teams score 2 tries and 17 points.

    Apologies for the delay in posting - needed some sleep.

    In the lead up to Toomuas try i think it was 4 or 5 phases previous, on the east side of the field Aidan Toua was tackled by Ben Tapuai which grounded Toua. Toua never releases the ball and gets up and plays on despite being in a completed tackle which brought him to ground. This tackle occured no more than 5 metres in front of 2 referees and nothing was called.

    I think most teams would not turn down a 17 point head start but hey the referee had no 'influence' did he.

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  2. #77
    Veteran valzc's Avatar
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    Definitely post these on GAGR please Andrew - entitled. "The Cloak Of Invisibility - the Brumbies"!

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  3. #78
    Champion andrewg's Avatar
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    Force v Brumbies - 40 to 80 minutes - FOR ME IT'S ALL ABOUT PROTECTING THE HEAD AND NECK

    Extremely pleased with the effort of the Force after the 30 minute mark.

    I'm only going to focus on the contact around the head and neck - ALL OF WHICH DIDN'T RATE ANY INTEREST FROM ANDREW LEES OF HIS ARs
    (Although I have commented on the other blatant omissions by Lees)

    31:58 - Toomua pulls Ainsley to the ground by his neck.

    (Aside: 34:25 - Hodgo gets his head taped up again. Doesn't he bleed easily/)

    38:20 - Alexander lays on a blatant and cynical offside in the ruck. But gets forgiven by Lees as "that's OK as he just got his timing wrong!"

    44:11 - Tessman tackles Pocock around head/neck and gets landed on by other players.

    54:28 Shoulder cleanout by Smiler on DHP.

    65:27 - Smiler strolls through ruck and disrupts new FH, Matt Hodgson, right in front of Lees who DOES ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. Slows down Hodgo. Worse than anything that Hodgo had done earlier.

    67:00 - On comes Robbie Coleman - the serial offender re grabs around head/neck.

    70:51 - Coleman high contact and tackle assist around DHP head.

    71:06 - Fardy tackles Hodgo around neck and pulls him to ground. Clear view to Lees. Results in TOW to Brumbies.

    77:17 - Coleman tackles Hodgo around the neck (after Hodgo has chased the loose ball) and wrenches him to ground. 4-5 other Brumbies jump on Hodgo while Coleman's still holding around the neck. I'm not going to mention the possible outcomes from this activity. Ask a rugby player about the range of possible outcomes.

    (From the replays the last minute try to the Brumbies appeared OK to me as well).

    By my count the Force copped 4 Penalties after around 60 minutes and the Brumbies copped 4 (but by my count above should have been 4 more and probably YC to either Fardy (for all of his naughty stuff early) and/or Coleman.

    My comment re Andrew Lees having a "good game".

    ABSOLUTE BS - AS HE PROVIDED ABSOLUTELY NO PROTECTION FOR THE BALL CARRIERS ESPECIALLY REGARDING BEING TACKLED AROUND HEAD AND NECK

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    Last edited by andrewg; 13-03-16 at 22:22.

  4. #79
    Veteran Ecky's Avatar
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    Sorry for those who were seeking a rebuttal.

    The group that I accompanied was part of a referee coaching task.
    This is entirely different to a referee assessing task.

    An assessing task would delve into the minutiae (like andrewg) whereas a coaching task looks at the overall picture of the official's game. If there were "critical incidents" that had a significant effect on a game (eg a score/non-score or injury) then that is considered/noted in either task.

    Every Super Rugby referee has an analysis post game. In this case I understand that the referee's coach met with Foles earlier today. That, I imagine, is where the specific events will be logged and discussed, with Lees' coach then providing this feedback to Lees to action where necessary.

    I was watching the game from a completely different perspective than someone watching the two teams, supporting one or the other. I did not watch a replay of the game. I only saw what replays were on the big screen at the ground.

    I had some issues with some of his performance. I have many notes about the game and, were I his coach and had the opportunity, these would have been on the table for discussion/review. But I didn't.

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    Last edited by Ecky; 13-03-16 at 14:24.

  5. #80
    Champion andrewg's Avatar
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    Ruck Involvement Stats from the WF v Brumbies Game

    Remember:
    1. Early means 1st or 2nd of player’s team AFTER the ball carrier has been tackled and brought to ground.
    2. Impact means active engagement: strong physical contact, changed shape of ruck, clean-out, protecting ball etc. (more than hand on someone’s bum or arriving after the hard work has been done). Yes it’s subjective - but as I collect all data at least it’s consistent.
    3. Impact DOES NOT equate to Effectiveness. I’ve concluded that coming up with an effectiveness measure is just too hard in the time that I have available – but open to suggestions.

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    Ruck Involvements Over Time

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    Last edited by andrewg; 14-03-16 at 14:38.

  6. #81
    Immortal GIGS20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ecky View Post
    If there were "critical incidents" that had a significant effect on a game (eg a score/non-score or injury) then that is considered/noted in either task.
    Critical incidents such as failing to act on a reckless incident of foul play which has the potential to cause injury? Or failing to act on a clear penalisable offence within 2 phases of a team scoring? Maybe even if that was done twice out of four tries? Or how about having such critically poor game management skills that after 20 minutes both captains were squabbling like kindergarten kids?

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    C'mon the

  7. #82
    Veteran Sheikh's Avatar
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    Tessman's stats make good reading (24 rucks in 55 minutes!), as does RHP's (more like a back-rower than lock, and he can play either role). Stander's stats make him look to have been a passenger in the 2nd half, but I recall he was tackling like a demon, so probably couldn't get to many rucks (not that that stops Hodgo!)

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  8. #83
    Legend Contributor Alison's Avatar
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    It's all very well giving feedback to Lees after the game and for his coach to get him to action whatever he needs to action, but by then it's too late!

    I know that like all of us, refs need to learn their trade and get on-the-job experience. But it's not right that it's always the lower ranked teams that they get to 'practice' on. Those teams need to learn from the top refs as well as the up and coming refs or they will never move forward either.

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  9. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alison View Post
    It's all very well giving feedback to Lees after the game and for his coach to get him to action whatever he needs to action, but by then it's too late!

    I know that like all of us, refs need to learn their trade and get on-the-job experience. But it's not right that it's always the lower ranked teams that they get to 'practice' on. Those teams need to learn from the top refs as well as the up and coming refs or they will never move forward either.
    Agreed, and Friday evening games was a clash between the top 2 on the Australian conference. Should've been treated as such.

    A number of Tahs fans calling foul as the same formula played out the week before.

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  10. #85
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    I have only seen the first half so far, but I am with Ecky. Lees isn't that bad.

    More importantly, how good do we look when we actually have the ball? Especially against arguably the best team in the competition. If we can get out set piece wobbles in gear, we could be a dangerous side. Tet Faulkner would definitely help out there.

    Also, Moore is a dick.

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    Last edited by James; 13-03-16 at 21:50.
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    RHP had a blinder - he was everywhere, and no charged down penalties. Great hitout for a first start - keep it up.

    I posted earlier about the HOPE - and James hit it on the head - we looked good with ball in hand. Someone else also said we looked like a team!

    for me - that is our starting XV -
    Tessman showed he was capable around the ground, but needed to get his throwing better,
    RHP smashed it,
    props needs some experience, so give them time. Perhaps they need to work on the Japanese style of attack scrum, straight out he back.
    9-10 was a good pairing, and prior really quickened the ball
    Lance was superb again (worried about grants kicking from hand)
    junior cannot be faulted with his game at 12, and has 3 TOW in 2 games
    tapuai has played superb at 13
    mesiwera is great
    morohan was solid, if not spectacular - found a bit more involvement htis game, which was nice
    DHP - another masterclass.

    Happy Palitu!

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  12. #87
    Champion andrewg's Avatar
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    Have just posted my Round 3 Ruck Analysis on Green & Gold Rugby.

    http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/sr-...lysis-round-3/

    Had to grit my teeth and NOT bag Andrew Lees.

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  13. #88
    Legend Contributor Alison's Avatar
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    You did really well! Very balanced piece - respect!

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  14. #89
    Veteran Ecky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GIGS20 View Post
    Critical incidents such as failing to act on a reckless incident of foul play which has the potential to cause injury? Or failing to act on a clear penalisable offence within 2 phases of a team scoring? Maybe even if that was done twice out of four tries? Or how about having such critically poor game management skills that after 20 minutes both captains were squabbling like kindergarten kids?
    No to all of those questions. Critical incidents are things such as those I described.
    The things you mention are in-game incidents; not critical incidents.
    I may not be explaining things very well, for which I apologise.

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  15. #90
    Veteran Ecky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alison View Post
    It's all very well giving feedback to Lees after the game and for his coach to get him to action whatever he needs to action, but by then it's too late!

    I know that like all of us, refs need to learn their trade and get on-the-job experience. But it's not right that it's always the lower ranked teams that they get to 'practice' on. Those teams need to learn from the top refs as well as the up and coming refs or they will never move forward either.
    In the interests of consistency, I would have thought it unfair if a referee coach intervenes at half time to the extent that a referee then referees the second half differently to the first.

    My opinion is that it is best to provide counsel post game.

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